"I purchased my system while the LightFX 2.0 was being falsely advertised. It is not mute to me."
Or to me - hence my push to promote the LightFX software in my sig.
"BTW...you have done much more than changed your MB to OC better. You have changed/upgraded your system to the point that it is unrecognizable as a 630i. If you didn't mention that it was once a 630i, no one could tell what system brand you have. I would have guessed custom."
If you read one of my previous posts here, I gave 4 reasons why I bought the XPS 630 and that reflects what I've done to it. For overclocking I upgraded the mobo. For future GPU updates, I upgraded the PSU. I knew nVidia's 200 series were coming out when I bought this, but they weren't available yet. I still have the CPU, an orginal HDD, the original Media Card reader w/Bluetooth, I still currently have the original GPUs but upgraded for water cooling, original optical drives, etc. I upgraded the OS because Dell did not offer Vista 64bit at the time, and I wanted all my RAM recognized. Basically, I knew I'd be doing all this in some point in time when I bought it.
For anyone who knows what a XPS 630 looks like and saw mine, they would think it's a upgraded 630 - which is just what it is:
And I futher customized it by modding the side panel:
A clear side panel is an option on the 730, but not the 630 - but that didn't stop me. :smileywink:
I also very much like the internal case layout of the 630, it's very well organized . Dell places the motherboard upside-down, allowing the case to open from the right instead of the left which I also prefer.
My #1 reason for the buying the 630 was standard ATX upgradability. And after the upgrades, all front connections still work, as well as the chassis lighting thanks to the MIO's ESA compatibility. If I knew then what I know now I still would've bought it because it still fit my needs and future wants.
Everyone is pretty much unique for their reasons for buying things, and I just gave you mine.
OK, I have waited all day for a response from Dell about whether or not these 630i's with the x2 gpu cards were in fact shipped with 750 chips. Getting a bit perturbed now. Chris_M can you clarify this matter or not?
That's part of the problem - up until a day or two ago, the sales information - both on the web and in the hands of the Dell sales folks, had the same erroneous information. It's only until you escalate to a manager or someone on the tech side that they (and you) learn that the x16s are running at x8. But then again, pretty hard to ask the question if you don't already know there's a problem.
* We have had the PCI Express 8 lanes specification posted in the
Owners Manual from day 1 of XPS 630 sales. So, you cannot say we hid that information. In my opinion, we should have posted this on the sales site Tech Specs, but that is not my call.
chembane,
OK, I have waited all day for a response from Dell about whether or not these 630i's with the x2 gpu cards were in fact shipped with 750 chips. Getting a bit perturbed now. Chris_M can you clarify this matter or not?
* No, they were not shipped with 750 chips.
Concerning the two XPS 630s that are showing the 750i chipset in CPU-Z. The chipset ID is the same between the 650i and 750i. One of the differences between the two is the 750i has an extra pci-e to pci-e bridge. The GeForce 9800 GX2 video card has its own pci-e to pci-e bridge. So, CPU-Z reads the chipset ID and checks to see if the bridge ID is present. It mistakenly notates the one on the GeForce 9800 GX2 video card and in summary, calls the PC chipset 750i. CPU-ID has the information and we have started communications with them to get their software corrected.
@Anonymous-Chris_M wrote:
Concerning the two XPS 630s that are showing the 750i chipset in CPU-Z. The chipset ID is the same between the 650i and 750i. One of the differences between the two is the 750i has an extra pci-e to pci-e bridge. The GeForce 9800 GX2 video card has its own pci-e to pci-e bridge. So, CPU-Z reads the chipset ID and checks to see if the bridge ID is present. It mistakenly notates the one on the GeForce 9800 GX2 video card and in summary, calls the PC chipset 750i. CPU-ID has the information and we have started communications with them to get their software corrected.
I'd like to believe what you are saying. The fact that the motherboard model is identical leads me to believe this is true, but there is one thing that concerns me.
My memory is a little fuzzy on this so hopefully someone else will chime in, but didn't CPU-Z report that the northbridge and southbridge on the XPS 700 was not really a 590 chipset? Then Dell got them to change the reports in the next software update. But if you pulled off the heatsinks, the chips were labeled what CPU-Z was originally reporting before being contacted by Dell. I would hope Dell is not doing the same thing again in their contact with CPU-ID?
The easiest way to tell would be if either of the two customers with the 750 results had another gpu card they could plug into the motherboard and see if the results change.
I don't see why a brand new computer can't have pci experess x16 slots, a technology that dell has been using for years. I really don't want to get rid of this computer, and If my very expensive video card still has both of its units running at 8x then I probabily wont, but If Its pushing them down to 4x then Im going to be forced to return it.
"* We have had the PCI Express 8 lanes specification posted in the Owners Manual from day 1 of XPS 630 sales. So, you cannot say we hid that information. In my opinion, we should have posted this on the sales site Tech Specs, but that is not my call."
No that isn't your call, Chris. No one is blaming you. But it was someone at Dell's call, and it is deceptive advertising at best (most would consider it false advertising since the customer has no reason to believe that they need to read the owners manual to find issues of false advertising). We generally believe what is in the Dell advertisements (or I should say that we use to believe what is in the Dell advertisements).
That's part of the problem - up until a day or two ago, the sales information - both on the web and in the hands of the Dell sales folks, had the same erroneous information. It's only until you escalate to a manager or someone on the tech side that they (and you) learn that the x16s are running at x8. But then again, pretty hard to ask the question if you don't already know there's a problem.
* We have had the PCI Express 8 lanes specification posted in the
Owners Manual from day 1 of XPS 630 sales. So, you cannot say we hid that information. In my opinion, we should have posted this on the sales site Tech Specs, but that is not my call.
Wow. Chris - you're right - it would be hard to say that because that's not what I said - not even close. What I'm saying is that, until recently, there was a real difference between what was advertised - 2 x16 - and what is being delivered - 2 x16 running at x8 (which should really just be 3 x8 given the other 1 x8 with the 630), and that the difference was not widely known within either the Dell sales community or the Dell user community. So, for a salesperson reading what Dell's sales materials actually said, and not knowing what was supposedly meant by those materials (that the x16s are really x8s), there could actually be an honest mistake being made in miscommunicating the 630s specs and capabilities.
What I take issue with is:
The amount of time this "revelation" that the x16s weren't as advertised took to trickle down to the sales force, if indeed this trickle down has occured
The even longer amount of time it took for this information to get to the website despite how hard you were pushing for this to happen
What this means is that the sales force has been put in the position of giving out incorrect information between the time that the "difference" was acknowledged and the time that the difference was corrected, leading many users to mistakenly believe that the information they received from Dell's sales force - who the consumer could rightly assume would actually have the right information about what they are selling - was correct.
And Chris, don't you dare try to say this is a case of "Read the Manual" (thank you filters...) on the user's part. Dell built these boxes, royally fouled up in communicating the specs, and sat on correcting the problem - even internally. Own the problem and quit saying it's our fault for actually believing your advertisements. If we were to follow your model, we should read the entire owner's manual for every product prior to making any purchase of any kind because the advertisements of the merchant and/or the knowledge of the sales force cannot be trusted to be factually correct. By extension, you are saying that no Dell advertisements or sales representatives should be believed, ever. If that's the case, why have them? Hardly the position for a leading PC manufacturer to take. C'mon Chris - you can do better than this.
PS: The Owner's Manual you refer to is for the 630i. Yes, it's the same unit as the 630, but, the manual doesn't say that, nor is the 630i marketed in the US. So, reading the manual for a product that isn't sold in your country and isn't identified as being identical to the product being sold in your country isn't going to help you unless you already know they are identical. Heck of a hurdle for the consumer, don't you think?
I know that there are valid complaints of false advertising by Dell regarding the specifications of this motherboard. * I disagree. The sales page was very clear in stating you would get two PCI Express x16 Expansion slots. It never stated how many PCI Express lanes were connected in those slots. That data is presented in teh User Manual specifications.
* C'mon Chris trhats the same as a used car salesman telling you he is selling you a car with a V-8 and you buy it then find out it is really only firing on 6 cylinders because he took the sparkplugs out of 2 cylinders.
How is the consumer supposed to see the user manual untill they buy the computer?
You admit that the sales page did not state how many lanes were connected to the slots; yet anyone who would see that advertisement would be falsely led to believe that they were getting X16 lanes because its a PCI Express x16 Expansion slot ! ! ! ! ! That is what the x16 means in technical terms ! ! ! !
acs9000
30 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 01:00
Rambler358
526 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 01:00
Or to me - hence my push to promote the LightFX software in my sig.
"BTW...you have done much more than changed your MB to OC better. You have changed/upgraded your system to the point that it is unrecognizable as a 630i. If you didn't mention that it was once a 630i, no one could tell what system brand you have. I would have guessed custom."
If you read one of my previous posts here, I gave 4 reasons why I bought the XPS 630 and that reflects what I've done to it. For overclocking I upgraded the mobo. For future GPU updates, I upgraded the PSU. I knew nVidia's 200 series were coming out when I bought this, but they weren't available yet. I still have the CPU, an orginal HDD, the original Media Card reader w/Bluetooth, I still currently have the original GPUs but upgraded for water cooling, original optical drives, etc. I upgraded the OS because Dell did not offer Vista 64bit at the time, and I wanted all my RAM recognized. Basically, I knew I'd be doing all this in some point in time when I bought it.
For anyone who knows what a XPS 630 looks like and saw mine, they would think it's a upgraded 630 - which is just what it is:
And I futher customized it by modding the side panel:
A clear side panel is an option on the 730, but not the 630 - but that didn't stop me. :smileywink:
I also very much like the internal case layout of the 630, it's very well organized . Dell places the motherboard upside-down, allowing the case to open from the right instead of the left which I also prefer.
My #1 reason for the buying the 630 was standard ATX upgradability. And after the upgrades, all front connections still work, as well as the chassis lighting thanks to the MIO's ESA compatibility. If I knew then what I know now I still would've bought it because it still fit my needs and future wants.
Everyone is pretty much unique for their reasons for buying things, and I just gave you mine.
chembane
32 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 02:00
DELL-Chris M
Community Manager
Community Manager
•
54.2K Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 05:00
That's part of the problem - up until a day or two ago, the sales information - both on the web and in the hands of the Dell sales folks, had the same erroneous information. It's only until you escalate to a manager or someone on the tech side that they (and you) learn that the x16s are running at x8. But then again, pretty hard to ask the question if you don't already know there's a problem.
* We have had the PCI Express 8 lanes specification posted in the Owners Manual from day 1 of XPS 630 sales. So, you cannot say we hid that information. In my opinion, we should have posted this on the sales site Tech Specs, but that is not my call.
chembane,
OK, I have waited all day for a response from Dell about whether or not these 630i's with the x2 gpu cards were in fact shipped with 750 chips. Getting a bit perturbed now. Chris_M can you clarify this matter or not?
* No, they were not shipped with 750 chips.
Concerning the two XPS 630s that are showing the 750i chipset in CPU-Z. The chipset ID is the same between the 650i and 750i. One of the differences between the two is the 750i has an extra pci-e to pci-e bridge. The GeForce 9800 GX2 video card has its own pci-e to pci-e bridge. So, CPU-Z reads the chipset ID and checks to see if the bridge ID is present. It mistakenly notates the one on the GeForce 9800 GX2 video card and in summary, calls the PC chipset 750i. CPU-ID has the information and we have started communications with them to get their software corrected.
Zoder
46 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 06:00
I'd like to believe what you are saying. The fact that the motherboard model is identical leads me to believe this is true, but there is one thing that concerns me.
My memory is a little fuzzy on this so hopefully someone else will chime in, but didn't CPU-Z report that the northbridge and southbridge on the XPS 700 was not really a 590 chipset? Then Dell got them to change the reports in the next software update. But if you pulled off the heatsinks, the chips were labeled what CPU-Z was originally reporting before being contacted by Dell. I would hope Dell is not doing the same thing again in their contact with CPU-ID?
The easiest way to tell would be if either of the two customers with the 750 results had another gpu card they could plug into the motherboard and see if the results change.
TDOGS630I
72 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 13:00
Rambler, how did you cut the logo in your case? Did you have it done professionally or do it yourself?
Looks great!
Durrthock
27 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 13:00
foehammer25
201 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 13:00
"* We have had the PCI Express 8 lanes specification posted in the Owners Manual from day 1 of XPS 630 sales. So, you cannot say we hid that information. In my opinion, we should have posted this on the sales site Tech Specs, but that is not my call."
No that isn't your call, Chris. No one is blaming you. But it was someone at Dell's call, and it is deceptive advertising at best (most would consider it false advertising since the customer has no reason to believe that they need to read the owners manual to find issues of false advertising). We generally believe what is in the Dell advertisements (or I should say that we use to believe what is in the Dell advertisements).
acs9000
30 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 13:00
Wow. Chris - you're right - it would be hard to say that because that's not what I said - not even close. What I'm saying is that, until recently, there was a real difference between what was advertised - 2 x16 - and what is being delivered - 2 x16 running at x8 (which should really just be 3 x8 given the other 1 x8 with the 630), and that the difference was not widely known within either the Dell sales community or the Dell user community. So, for a salesperson reading what Dell's sales materials actually said, and not knowing what was supposedly meant by those materials (that the x16s are really x8s), there could actually be an honest mistake being made in miscommunicating the 630s specs and capabilities.
What I take issue with is:
What this means is that the sales force has been put in the position of giving out incorrect information between the time that the "difference" was acknowledged and the time that the difference was corrected, leading many users to mistakenly believe that the information they received from Dell's sales force - who the consumer could rightly assume would actually have the right information about what they are selling - was correct.
And Chris, don't you dare try to say this is a case of "Read the Manual" (thank you filters...) on the user's part. Dell built these boxes, royally fouled up in communicating the specs, and sat on correcting the problem - even internally. Own the problem and quit saying it's our fault for actually believing your advertisements. If we were to follow your model, we should read the entire owner's manual for every product prior to making any purchase of any kind because the advertisements of the merchant and/or the knowledge of the sales force cannot be trusted to be factually correct. By extension, you are saying that no Dell advertisements or sales representatives should be believed, ever. If that's the case, why have them? Hardly the position for a leading PC manufacturer to take. C'mon Chris - you can do better than this.
PS: The Owner's Manual you refer to is for the 630i. Yes, it's the same unit as the 630, but, the manual doesn't say that, nor is the 630i marketed in the US. So, reading the manual for a product that isn't sold in your country and isn't identified as being identical to the product being sold in your country isn't going to help you unless you already know they are identical. Heck of a hurdle for the consumer, don't you think?
Durrthock
27 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 15:00
KryttosArcadia
129 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 17:00
ElkWapiti
513 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 18:00
+1
Gorgeous
kevink37
139 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 19:00
Rambler358
526 Posts
0
August 2nd, 2008 23:00
Thanks - I created the design, and had a local machine shop cut it for me.
chembane
32 Posts
0
August 3rd, 2008 07:00
"QUOTE" DELL-Chris_M
MaverickmanTP,
I know that there are valid complaints of false advertising by Dell regarding the specifications of this motherboard.
* I disagree. The sales page was very clear in stating you would get two PCI Express x16 Expansion slots. It never stated how many PCI Express lanes were connected in those slots. That data is presented in teh User Manual specifications.
* C'mon Chris trhats the same as a used car salesman telling you he is selling you a car with a V-8 and you buy it then find out it is really only firing on 6 cylinders because he took the sparkplugs out of 2 cylinders.
How is the consumer supposed to see the user manual untill they buy the computer?
You admit that the sales page did not state how many lanes were connected to the slots; yet anyone who would see that advertisement would be falsely led to believe that they were getting X16 lanes because its a PCI Express x16 Expansion slot ! ! ! ! ! That is what the x16 means in technical terms ! ! ! !