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Dell Latitude 7480 Laptop that freezes up
We have a Dell Latitude 7480 Laptop that freezes up. The computer can just be running but sitting unused or in the midst of heavy processing. The screen is locked up to the last image, but the keyboard, mouse-pad, and external mouse (if being used) have no impact on the Laptop. Letting it sit while locked up has no impact on it. We can power it down with the power button and that unlocks it for a while. Dell onsite support could not fix it, and two returns to the Dell repair center did not help despite replacing drives and new OS (Windows 10). We just had Dell send out a tech who replaced the motherboard, memory, and Drive. It froze up on us twice within hours. We and Dell seem to be stumped.
We just performed the full ePSA test several times with no findings. BIOS = 1.9.3 EPSA: Build 4304.17 UEFI ROM. Has anyone had any similar issues.
vovailchenko
1 Message
2
May 27th, 2018 06:00
Hello. i seem to have very similar issue.
the only thing i was able to identify is that safe boot never hangs.
this means if i boot in safe mode - it's always stable.
i was also able to perform a clean boot - e.g. turn off all auto-startups and non-Microsoft services - it seems also to resolve it. but the moment i try to install something - it freezes or throws a BSOD on me.
I've tried exchanging memory and SSD - no luck.
i've restored system several times with no luck
i've reinstalled Win10 from usb flash - no luck.
i'm in the initial stage currently with Dell support.
Do you have any luck since you've written the original post?
Joppedi72
1 Message
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May 28th, 2018 04:00
Try replacing the SSD with one from another manufacturer.
That solved our problem with random freezing.
Dr.Rob
3 Posts
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June 1st, 2018 10:00
We are on the third drive and two motherboards. Dell has worked on this four times to no avail.
Dr.Rob
3 Posts
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June 1st, 2018 10:00
We will try to see if ours acts differently in safe mode.
I think Dell is going to send us another laptop (remanufactured). I hope this takes care of it.
Hard telling what the exchange unit had, has wrong with it if anything.
Mc_Phil
3 Posts
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June 19th, 2018 08:00
We've had some recurring issues with 7480 lockups. I've had 5 that have had motherboards replaced in the last couple of weeks. I spoke with someone at Dell who was on the diagnostics team and they had a number of systems in their lab that they were trying to diagnose with the same problem and they hadn't figured out what was causing it. For the ones that I've had issues with the motherboard replacement has fixed the issue so far, although the rep from the diagnostic team admitted that changing the motherboard didn't seem to always fix the problem.
The ones I've seen here occasionally throw a BSOD but the dump never completes and just hangs at 0%. Same as you it can happen either under active processing or sitting with no action. I had one that locked up within 15 minutes after every reboot. The tech I spoke with who replaced most of the motherboards said he's seen a lot of this lately.
Interestingly, I ran one of these systems off of a Linux Live USB stick for hours with no issues so I suspect some specific Windows based interaction with drivers or the system chipset, but for whatever reason a newer revision of the motherboard on the ones that we had fixed the issue. The worst of this started happening a couple of months ago so I'm wondering if there was a very low level OS change in Windows around that time that has been causing this. Maybe this is related to Spectre/Meltdown mitigations? Still a mystery to me.
RandomFolder
2 Posts
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June 20th, 2018 00:00
I created an account just to add to this thread.
Check your power supply. I have frequent freezes when I work from home, but never while using the docking station here at work. I brought in the power supply I use at home today and for the first time the laptop froze at work as well.
Running on battery at the moment. Will switch to docking station later. Then back to this apparently faulty power supply toward the end of the day so that we can try and simulate this problem with more predictability.
I bet it's the power supply that on the blink.
Also, even though the power cable fits into the laptop I have some doubt that the power supply model I'm using was meant for this particular laptop.
Dell-Alan D
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June 20th, 2018 06:00
Hi @Mc_Phil, as the system is working fine on Linux that would suggest the hardware is working fine. As this issue occurred just a few months ago that coincides with the latest Microsoft Spring Creators update release. I suspect this may be what is causing the issue rather than Spectre/Meltdown. Bios releases have been released to address the Spectre / Meltdown issues which should be applied to the systems as a matter of urgency.
Have you tried rolling back the systems to pre Spring Creators update and seeing if they still lock up?
Additionally, are you running corporate images on your systems?
Can you try rolling back the graphics driver to revision A02 and test the system to see if it's more stable using that version over the latest one. It can be downloaded here
You will need to do a clean install of the graphics driver for this to work. This means uninstalling the graphics driver and any associated graphics card applications and then restarting the machine to install the A02 revision. You may need to carry out that step a few times to remove all previous revisions of the driver. If you use Dell Command Update on these systems you will need to set it so that it doesn't update the graphics driver when run.
Alan
Dell-Alan D
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June 20th, 2018 06:00
Hi @RandomFolder, thanks for adding to the thread. It's quite possible that a power supply could cause a lock up, however I think there may be more to it for the other posters.
If your ac adaptor is causing this issue and it's an official Dell ac adaptor I can get this replaced for you. I'll drop you a private message to get some details from you.
Alan
RandomFolder
2 Posts
1
June 20th, 2018 07:00
Turns out it wasn't the power supply either. We used a brand new one from a still boxed machine and my machine locked up just the same. It happens within minutes of booting up on the power supply (frequency increased noticeably over the last few days so it's like it's gathered momentum / typical of a hardware fault). All system updates have been applied by the way.
We have logged a call though, my colleague had the same issue and Dell replaced his board. And he's not even a developer! We just need to run the diagnostics still (though I wonder what that could show as you're about to read next).
It's strange though because it never happens when I'm on the docking station or just using battery power. I would use battery power exclusively at home but (un)fortunately I'm a developer so my machine does some intense things most of the time so I need either get another docking station or work from the office exclusively until I get this sorted out.
VinceBusMaximus
6 Posts
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June 20th, 2018 08:00
Similar issues - 20% failure rate on a large batch of Latitude 7390 computers we deployed in mid-March. We're at our wits' end with these and ready to ship them all back and move to Lenovo if we don't get satisfaction soon.
Sharing a Reddit post I made on the Dell sub; didn't get any response but maybe something in this post sparks an idea for somebody else. Or at least, lets you know you're not alone :-)
I will say, we're becoming more convinced by the hour that this is a hardware issue as we search and test and try different things. (we've had more Latitudes fail since the original post, which is why the numbers don't match up if you were wondering).
"Just looking to see if anybody else with a similar set-up has been experiencing the same thing as described below. Anything jump out at anybody else?
Banging my head against the wall here, and want to go into the next round of ProSupport with as much info and testing results as I can. Certainly not expecting anybody to deep-dive - again, just curious to find one other person with the same issue/similar environment to compare notes with.
Here's what I have:
43 new Latitude 7390's, deployed over three weeks from March to April 2018.
We're now on the 6th one with serious BSOD issues.
Four show WHEA_UNCORRECTABLE_ERROR, but the two most recent ones are barfing with SYSTEM_SERVICE_EXCEPTION (bug check code = 0x0000003b and pointing to asmtxhci.sys, according to BlueScreenView).
(Note that these computers are not always capturing the .dmp files, despite verifying that we've got the correct settings in place for capture)
Software deployment is pretty standard: O365 (also including Skype, Teams and Yammer desktop apps), Acrobat DC, Webroot. Drivers and BIOS current according to Dell Command Update. Verified the intel stuff directly on intel's site; driver versions match. BSOD happening on fully patched 1709 or 1803, with updates coming from an internal WSUS. Hppens on the docks and off the docks, on AC power or off AC power.
Hardware: hard drives under BitLocker; Dell Thunderbolt docks; Dell wireless keyboards/mice (dongles in dock). Variety of monitors and connection types, including HDMI and DP; some adapters in use (i.e., DVI to HDMI). 16 gigs RAM, i7 (8th gen), SSD drives.
Lots of back and forth with ProSupport on the first 4 bad units, including a remote session. The bad units passed all the Dell diagnostics. Dell eventually agreed to ship us replacement units. That's great, but with two more now starting to BS, I'm wondering how many more times I'm going to have to go through this.
Our suspicions have so far centered around a couple of hunches/leads:
Thermal management? Some of the 'bad' ones did seem to run hotter, way more fan activity than we expected. We completely pulled and reinstalled anything related to Intel's thermal mgt. drivers. No joy.
Integrated graphics issue?
Microsoft Teams? Sounds crazy - it's an Electron app, nothing fancy. Yet it frequently consumes 2-4 gb of RAM and users report that their systems work better when sticking with the purely Web version. Lots of complaints to be found after searching the Googles, too. One user stopped running the app for a few days - and stopped BSOD'ing. We were hopeful, but then it started happening again. D'oh!
Going to try my hand at Driver Verifier next.
The newer replacement units haven't experienced this yet. Which makes me wonder about a bad 'batch' of hardware, but I'll admit I have no idea how Dell's production logistics work."
Dell-Alan D
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June 21st, 2018 01:00
Hi @VinceBusMaximus,
Thanks for reaching out to the forums for support. I've spoke to engineering about this issue and they are still investigating exactly what's causing the issue with the Blue Screens i.e the Windows Spring update or the Intel graphics driver. They have suggested the following as a temporary fix, so far we have had multiple reports that it should resolve the issue :-
Can you try rolling back the graphics driver to revision A02 and test the system to see if it's more stable using that version over the latest one. It can be downloaded here
You will need to do a clean install of the graphics driver for this to work. This means uninstalling the graphics driver and any associated graphics card applications and then restarting the machine to install the A02 revision. You may need to carry out that step a few times to remove all previous revisions of the driver. If you use Dell Command Update on these systems you will need to set it so that it doesn't update the graphics driver when run.
If that fails to resolve the issue you would need to clean install the OS and then install the A02 graphics driver during the driver install.
I hope this helps
Alan
Dell-Alan D
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June 21st, 2018 03:00
@RandomFolder, that's strange that it only happens off the docking station. It changes the troubleshooting steps quite a bit.
If you are getting a motherboard replaced I shall leave you to work with the case owner. If you need any additional help after the motherboard has been replaced, get back in touch and I'll see what I can do to help.
Alan
Mc_Phil
3 Posts
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July 3rd, 2018 07:00
It looks like all of the update emails on this thread were getting caught in our **bleep** filter so I just saw some of these responses.
@Dell-Alan D
Yes I suspect the hardware is fine, but there could also be minor hardware/chipset related changes in play that cause an issue in Windows. We are not running the Spring Creator's update (1803). We are on 1709 and I would never update to a major release change until a couple rounds of patches are out in the wild. We use Windows 10 Enterprise and I have a deployment server to image these. I use the latest Dell deployment drivers that get injected into the image during the deployment process. I also have a script to update the BIOS if it is out of date. I don't use Dell Command update since I want to be able to control driver versions that are applied in our company for the sake of internal compatibility testing as needed
Spectre/Meltdown mitigations have been extremely buggy so guessing at that being an issue is not out of the realm of possibility. Intel and Microsoft have both released buggy updates to the point where some of the early updates were pulled by both of them and OEMs including Dell stopped using them for a while. It was also stated many places back when Spectre and Meltdown were discovered that while some things could be addressed in software, full patching of these vulnerabilities would require hardware level changes. With as many issues as there have been with these patches, I would not rule out something that changed in a driver or in Windows to address these or other vulnerabilities that could cause these issues. All of these bugs and issues have been well documented by many others.
I've done the video driver rollback, had system boards replaced, re-imaged with a fresh Dell system image, imaged multiple times from my deployment server, changed drivers, all of that and this issue remains. I've been in direct communication for the last few weeks with the Dell diagnostics team that has been working on this issue and the last update I got said they still didn't know the root cause. The video driver and the system board replacements seem to have limited impact that can occasionally fix the problem, but not always. That is information straight from the diagnostics team in my communications with them.
Since these lockups never complete a error dump/bluescreen dump there is little to go on. I have a system next to me on my desk that I am tweaking every time I think to try something different. Like others on here and elsewhere all diagnostic checks complete with no errors. I've also done fully memory checks, disk integrity checks, and CPU stress testing and all of those seem to indicate the hardware is fine, but the lockups continue.
@VinceBusMaximus
Same basic issues as you've observed with your 7390s on the 7480s that have had the problem. These are 7th gen i7s with 32GB RAM and 512 m2 SSDs. On the ones I have the blue screen crash dump never completes. The blue screen always hangs at 0%. Most of the time I don't even get a blue screen error, just a complete lockup. We have some with Thunderbolt chips and some without so we are using the D6000 USB-C docks which are listed as compatible with systems with or without Thunderbolt. Lockups on and off the dock. We just got a batch of 7490s and I was hopeful this issue would be resolved with them, but if you're seeing the same things with your 7390s I'm guessing we'll see the same thing here.
Software deployed here is pretty similar, except I don't currently deploy Teams to everyone and we use Trend Micro for AV. I also don't use Dell Command Update, but I regularly download the latest deployment driver packs from Dell.
I've gone down some of the same paths as you. I haven't noticed major heat related issues, but the ones I've had with this issue are sometimes a little warm. Integrated graphics could be a factor. As noted above according to the diagnostics team that I'm getting updates from they think the Intel video driver is a factor, but not the root cause. I've also gone down disabling processor C-States and many other processor settings in the BIOS. I thought I might have found something after disabling the S3 sleep state. It seems to have helped in certain circumstances on my test system next to me on my desk, but I could just be imagining this at this point since I've cycled this thing so many times now.
We have issues with Teams as well (even though I don't deploy it some people/groups do use it). It's been well documented to be quite buggy by others in the past so we don't use it much right now. Those who do use it have frequent issues with it.
I just downloaded the Microsoft Driver SDK yesterday and I'm going down the path of checking sleep and power management states with the pwrtest tool that's included in there. If I find anything I'll post back.
TSuominen
2 Posts
0
July 9th, 2018 03:00
Hi
I have exactly same here. Latitude 7480 (i7, 16GB ram) with latest bios (1.10.1), win10 (1803), 64Bit, Edu.
Tryed with clean windows, install ok, first log in, it works (worst case) 33 seconds and after that, total freeze.
Dell support suggest to downgrade intel vga drivers, but no help. Running in safe mode (with LAN), no problems, no freezing, works fine.
If i reboot after freezing (immediately), it will crash in less than 2 minutes, usually after login it ends to BSOD with 0%.
But if i leave it for longer time without power (cable off), around half an hour, it will boot up normally and will freeze after 10-15 minutes later. Now i find out that just before it freezes, processor fan speeds up for 5-10 seconds and then is going to normal and then few seconds later freeze. No BSOD, just everything freezes.
Motherboard and SSD changed by Dell support, but still same problems.
I am running out of ideas...
Dell-Alan D
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July 10th, 2018 07:00
Hi @TSuominen, thanks for the detailed response. Can you advise if you have tried the following scenario -
Clean build of OS and manually install the drivers in order but install the Rev 2 version of the graphics driver rather than installing all the latest drivers and then downgrading?
Alan