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XPS 15 9570 would not boot from M.2 Sata SSD drive
Can I boot XPS 15 9570 from the internal M.2 Sata SSD drive? I am trying to install Debian 9.7 on XPS 15 9570 with a Samsung 860 EVO M.2 Sata (not the original NVMe drive). I made sure that I changed the AHCI before installing the Linux, but the laptop still will not boot from the 860 SSD. I checked that the system information did recognize the 860 as M.2 Sata drive, while both the Primary and ePCI are empty.
Are there any special BIOS settings to allow XPS 15 to boot from a internal M.2 Sata SSD drive?
Thanks
jphughan
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February 15th, 2019 08:00
On an XPS 15 9570 that only has an M.2 SATA SSD installed, the primary drive and PCI drive missing would be expected. "Primary drive" would refer to the 2.5" SATA interface that XPS 15 models with the smaller battery can accommodate, and PCI drive would refer to an NVMe SSD if you had one installed in that M.2 slot instead.
You shouldn't have to register the bootloader file manually; that's supposed to be done as part of the OS install routine. If you want to try it though, you'd click Add Boot Option, browse to the EFI partition that should exist on your SSD if you've already installed Linux, and then select the bootloader file -- although I'm not sure what that is for Linux. The UEFI spec defines a standard bootloader file path of \EFI\Boot\Bootx64.efi, which is used on bootable USB devices, but for example Window installations use a different bootloader file called Bootmgr.efi on their EFI partition.
If you haven't already, try just reinstalling Linux. When you do this, make sure you use the F12 to boot from your flash drive and choose the option under the UEFI section of the boot options. If you have Legacy Option ROMs enabled in your BIOS settings, then your flash drive will show up under both Legacy and UEFI options, and you want the latter.
Saltgrass
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February 15th, 2019 05:00
When you change your system to AHCI, you are turning off the SATA driver for the M.2 slot. Since you are trying to use a SATA drive, you should still have it set to RAID.
jphughan
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February 15th, 2019 08:00
This is completely wrong. Switching to AHCI turns off the Intel Rapid Storage controller. AHCI mode does not prevent you from using SATA SSDs, in fact it was introduced back back when SATA drives first arrived, and consequently AHCI mode has been available in the BIOS options of all Dell PC models (and other vendors' models) that shipped with SATA support even before NVMe existed, and they can be used just fine in AHCI mode. In fact I'm typing this post from an XPS 15 9530 that has a SATA SSD running in AHCI mode right now!
@DistFriend, turning on RAID will prevent you from using Linux because it doesn't support the Intel RST controller. As for why your system won't boot, the Linux installation might not have registered its bootloader file into the UEFI firmware as a boot option properly. With Legacy BIOS systems, you would just choose to boot from a particular device, but UEFI systems don't work like that. However, out of curiosity if you press F12 during startup to access the one-time boot menu, do you see your SSD as a boot option there?
DistFriend
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February 15th, 2019 08:00
@Saltgrass
I also tried using RAID, and it won't boot either.
@jphughan
When I use F12 and check the System information. I can see the M.2 SATA, but both the Primary drive and PCI drive are missing. I also went into the boot sequence, and the UEFI "View" button complaints that it cannot find any file system.
How do I register my bootloader file into the UEFI firmware as a boot option properly? would it improve if I install Debian on a NMVe PCI SSD? Thanks
Saltgrass
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February 15th, 2019 10:00
@jphughan
The Intel Rapid Response Storage driver is the SATA controller driver.
The 9530 is not M.2 PCIe capable.
jphughan
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February 15th, 2019 11:00
@Saltgrass, those are not interchangeable terms. First of all, it's the Rapid Storage controller, not driver. BIOS options do not enable or disable drivers. Also, "Rapid Response" is a particular technology that requires the Rapid Storage controller (and the Rapid Storage driver), but is a separate entity because the Rapid Storage controller has other uses. There is no such thing as "Rapid Response Storage driver".
But most importantly, disabling Rapid Storage does not disable SATA support. Yes I realize that the XPS 15 9530 does not support PCIe SSDs, which is my entire point. If your claim that selecting AHCI mode disables SATA support were accurate, that mode would render my system's SSD completely useless, which obviously isn't the case. And again, AHCI mode existed on systems that only supported SATA drives for years before NVMe existed -- why do you think that would be the case if AHCI disabled SATA support? And lastly, the Rapid Storage controller isn't even limited to SATA. It is a RAID controller, and on systems that support both SATA and NVMe, it can interface with both.
Based on your posts in various threads around here, you seem to have a lot of difficulty understanding the purpose and function of the Rapid Storage controller and the RAID vs. AHCI settings. Previously you've claimed that enabling RAID causes NVMe traffic to be routed over SATA, which is refuted by simple benchmarks showing NVMe SSDs returning performance well beyond any SATA standards even when the system is in RAID mode, and now you're here claiming that enabling AHCI disables M.2 SATA support, which is also easily disproven by the fact that one can access an M.2 SATA SSD even while the system is in AHCI mode. Worse, now in this thread you told the OP to put his system into RAID mode to install Linux, which won't work regardless of whether the system has an M.2 SATA or M.2 NVMe SSD installed because Linux doesn't have an Intel RST driver to interface with the RST controller that becomes active when RAID mode is enabled. Consider prefacing some of your statements with "I think" rather than spreading misinformation represented as fact.
Saltgrass
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February 15th, 2019 13:00
I have said it before and you still do not understand. Changing the Bios to AHCI switches the M.2 slot to PCIe (NVMe), which is why Ubuntu needs the AHCI setting.… Instead of criticizing me, maybe you should get a new system so YOU could test...
I really hate doing this in a thread but would much rather concentrate on the OP.
jphughan
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February 15th, 2019 14:00
I consider making sure the OP gets accurate information to be concentrating on the OP. The fact that you've said something before does not make it true. And the problem isn't that I don't understand what you're saying; it's that I know what you're saying is FALSE. AHCI absolutely does not switch the M.2 slot to NVMe-only. Again, if that were the case, then why would systems that have M.2 slots that ONLY support SATA even have an AHCI mode setting, which they do? What you're saying makes absolutely zero sense. AHCI mode has been around since long before NVMe even existed!
As for newer systems, I also have an XPS 13 9350, and just for you, I just now installed an M.2 SATA SSD into that system, confirmed it was in AHCI mode, and booted it from a Linux Live flash drive. It detected the M.2 SATA SSD just fine -- as a SATA device. So no, AHCI does not disable SATA on the M.2 slot, nor does it cause the M.2 slot to operate exclusively as an NVMe interface, because there is no way to run SATA over NVMe, or for that matter NVMe over SATA. The RST controller itself is exposed as a PCIe device to the OS when it is active, but it still interfaces back with storage devices on their native interface.
AHCI mode is required for Linux purely because Linux does not have an RST RAID driver built into its kernel, and since the RST controller sits between the OS and the storage when it's active due to RAID mode being on, not having an RST RAID driver means Linux can't see the storage behind it, regardless of whether it's SATA or NVMe. This abstraction is also why RAID mode allows running Windows 7 on an NVMe SSD (if you provide an RST RAID driver) even though Windows 7 does not have built-in NVMe support. By comparison, AHCI mode disables the RST controller, thereby exposing storage devices via their raw interfaces, and Linux DOES have an AHCI driver and native NVMe support. Same for Windows 8 and up.
AHCI mode disables the RST controller, and RAID mode enables it. That's all there is to it.
jphughan
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February 15th, 2019 15:00
Here you go @Saltgrass. Since you told me I should test, I figured I'd not only do that but post actual results. Below are screenshots I just captured from my Latitude 7480, which has an M.2 slot that supports both SATA and NVMe SSDs. I started with a Micron M.2 SATA SSD and then swapped in a Toshiba M.2 NVMe SSD. Both SSDs were tested under both AHCI and RAID mode. Note the "Type" field in the diskpart output for each case. Also note the Location Path, specifically that in AHCI mode, the SATA SSD is found on an ATA controller (which itself interfaces with the chipset over PCIe), and the NVMe SSD is found on an NVMe controller -- so no, AHCI mode does not disable SATA support on M.2 or cause SATA SSDs to run over NVMe, which isn't even possible.
Your move sharing any test results you have to support your claims....
M.2 SATA SSD in AHCI mode
M.2 SATA SSD in RAID mode
M.2 NVMe SSD in AHCI mode
M.2 NVMe SSD in RAID mode
DistFriend
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February 16th, 2019 16:00
mhbuzios
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April 13th, 2019 14:00
If help I did upgrade mine to 970 EVO M.2 NVMe 1 Tb and it works fine also I make a disk to disk with the AOMEI free software. it works perfect and also it is very fast!!! and it makes a low hit and this is very important with the NVMe M.2 Drives.