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July 27th, 2014 20:00

XPS-600 Repairable?

Hi, All-

Just joined the forums to ask a hardware question. I have an XPS-600 that just recently stopped working. Although it was complaining about a low CMOS battery, which is no doubt true, I noticed two bad capacitors on the mother board when I had it open this evening. Although I haven't been deep enough into the hardware to know any specifics about these electrolytics yet, they are labeled C6H3 and C7H1. Both have obviously vented out of their tops. I see slight bulging and electrolyte on the aluminum. The two caps are at the bottom end of the RAM bank and closest to it.

I will give full particulars later, as needed- service tag and such. Given that I am pretty good with computer hardware, having built, serviced, and modified a lot of towers over the past 18 years or so, and given that I am an experienced electronics engineer/tech who is pretty good at soldering, I want to ask the group a couple of questions. (Needless to say, this box is long out of warranty)

For those of you who have dealt with this well known problem with the flaky electrolytics which plagued several manufacturers a while back, I would like to hear your opinion as to whether simply replacing any obviously bad caps is likely or not to cause the mobo to basically spring back to life? Or is it more often the case that the exploding caps have taken out other power supply components on the mobo? Or, worst case- is it possible that such component failures can kill the power supply? I would assume the supply is reasonably well designed to protect itself against output shorts?

My hunch is that replacing these two caps can bring it back to life. What say, Guys?

Thanks, Clutter

78 Posts

July 27th, 2014 22:00

If you get the exact same capacitors (C6H3 and C7H1) then I see no problem and if there was a problem then the PSU won't suddenly die but the motherboard will die more then anything.

July 27th, 2014 23:00

Thanks! Well, I hope to also hear from others who have dealt with this specific problem. I consider it very likely the power supply is designed to protect itself against over current or short circuits. When I turn on the computer I get some sort of error 'beep code' and the unit will not pass POST. Also I never see anything going to the monitor, nothing, not even the boot info.

BTW this may be a normal 'field failure' of these two components, I suppose. The computer lasted for years before it started blowing caps. I doubt this is any part of that rash of capacitor failures we heard about like ~10 years ago.

I do plan to take the computer apart soon, so I can see what manufacturer made the electrolytic caps, also to see how hard it will be to get them out. I do have a desoldering station so I can probably do that just fine.

9 Legend

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47K Posts

July 28th, 2014 10:00

Given the extremely proprietary nature of the XPS600 power supply It might be a better deal to buy a Dell Precision 380 as a replacement.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dell-Precision-Workstation-380-3GHz-1GB-80GB-SATA-CD-Win-XP-Pro-COA-PW380-/380866303401

 

July 28th, 2014 23:00

I was amazed to see the price on Ebay. Pretty reasonable, actually. I'm curious enough that I'm going to research that model to see what performance level it represented at the time of its design/manufacture. Thanks for an interesting idea!

There is no doubt I am going to at least try to fix my mobo, however. I'm pretty geeky, also pretty
 hardware- oriented, and a small matter like removing and replacing a couple of electrolytic caps does not scare me at all. I'm just hoping that maybe some few others in this forum have been through this. It would be especially useful if I could hear from someone who has dealt with this specific Dell model, the XPS-600 having this sort of problem.

Your comments about how proprietary the power supply is are also of interest. Here's hoping that it is well enough designed to protect itself against output shorts. I bet it is. If so, removing the fault(s) should bring that board back to life. I kind of think the odds are with me right now. I am fearless when it comes to this sort of rework soldering job. Now if I had failed IC's, OTOH, I would hang it up and retire the board.

The worst thing that is going to happen here is that I'm going to end up with some RAM a hard drive, and some useful peripherals. And of course a dead mobo. That would be OK. Best case, my simple repairs bring it back to life.

July 29th, 2014 17:00

Followup for SpeedStep-

Although I would like to leave my question open for now, as I definitely plan to try repairs to

my XPS-600 mobo, I did become tempted enough to go for the Precision 380 in the auction

you linked to. Turned out they had the auction but no longer had the computer. He offered an

upgrade, a Precision 390, and after researching that one as well, I went with that swap.

I figure this will probably work out OK for me, and was a good suggestion.

I bet I can coax my XPS-600 back to life, however...

August 4th, 2014 23:00

Followup for SpeedStep-

I received a PW390 in good working condition with E6420 C2D 2.13GHz, 1G DDR2/667 ECC, 80G 7200 SATA HD, and FX-3450 video card. I'm generally happy with the hardware. I found an E6700 2.66GHz on Ebay for a very reasonable 20 dollars. Also picked up a P8016 heatsink and 2x 2G DDR2 5300U, also very reasonable. I think that's enough of a bump up to keep me happy.

The FX-3450 is loud. Fan runs full on, I believe (under Linux Mint 17 Mate 64bit). I found a pretty geeky solution for possibly gaining control of that fan speed:

http://crunchbang.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=18919

There are other methods as well- or maybe I'll just get a fanless card.

My XPS-600 is now on the workbench downstairs and ready to be pulled apart. I think I have a good chance of fixing it by removing and replacing the two swollen caps. I'll let you know how that went...

August 13th, 2014 04:00

Here is my XPS-600 mobo being reworked. Two capacitors, C6H3 and C7H1, have been removed from the board. They turn out to be Rubycon MFZ types, apparently- 2700uF 6.3V. They have vented through the top of the aluminum cans, which have bulged up and show electrolyte on them.

http://i537.photobucket.com/albums/ff333/Cluttermagnet/DSCF1521a1_zps3f261da9.jpg?t=1407924701

Here's a shot of the mother board. I think I managed to get the caps out without damaging the through hole plating. Now I have to find out if there was anything special about these, such as low ESR or high rated ripple current, etc. and then get some replacements.

http://i537.photobucket.com/albums/ff333/Cluttermagnet/DSCF1524a1_zps0805e4ba.jpg?t=1407924714

If you look carefully, you may see the 4 holes that have been cleared of solder. They are about an inch below the center of the black handle on the reamer (drill bit) tool.


Edit: They are ultra low ESR types. I ordered some from China. Shipping takes 1-3 weeks.

(Sound of fingertips drumming on desk...)

September 3rd, 2014 05:00

I did successfully replace the two capacitors, C6H3 and C7H1 and returned the board to service about a week ago. Based on both on line research plus continuing symptoms I'm seeing at bootup, I think the board is going to need further work. I think the mobo is eating CMOS batteries, and that this may be due to leakage currents pulling down a supply bus, allowing the battery to discharge when the computer is powered off. I often have to reset the date and time at bootup, and there are constantly boot time messages about the battery being low- despite replacing it several times. BTW my main guess is that the leakage current could likely be caused by other failing electrolytic capacitors such as those two. If I find that the same value capacitors are in use at other places on the board, I will replace those too, as a precaution. I only needed two of them, had to buy 20, so I have a few more to sprinkle around that board.

This is apparently a fairly frequent problem on this mobo:

http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=37057

http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=25306

I found several threads in the Dell forums regarding a documentation error that was causing users to install new CMOS batteries backwards. The correct way is with the side marked + (positive) inboard- towards the inside and NOT visible from the outside under the battery holder clip.


Some users have had the Via chipset fail on the mobo, others have found failed power FET's and especially failed toroidal inductors right next to those two caps which usually fail. I saw one photo online (2nd link above) where the inductor got hot enough to char the PC board underneath it. A lot of these problems seem to ultimately trace to fan failures and overall airflow problems.


Personally, I'm going to try to keep my XPS 600 going for a while longer, though I did take SpeedStep's suggestion and bought a used Precision 390 on Ebay as a possible replacement for the XPS. I'm very happy with my PW390 BTW. I found my XPS only had 2G of slower DDR2 533MHz RAM. I bumped it up to 4G DDR2 667MHz. That will help my Linux Mint 17 OS (64 bit), though not XP 32 bit. I'll be replacing my Pentium D 2.8GHz 320 with a 3.2 GHZ 340. The faster CPU is dirt cheap on Ebay now. I also put in a slightly better video card. They are also getting pretty cheap on Ebay. I have a couple of the nVidia Quadro FX-3700 cards. May even try them SLI, just to see how that goes. If and when the XPS completely fails, these parts can live on in other towers.

September 3rd, 2014 05:00

Tyrandis wrote the following post at 27 Jul 2014 11:08 PM:

"If you get the exact same capacitors (C6H3 and C7H1) then I see no problem and if there was a problem then the PSU won't suddenly die but the motherboard will die more then anything."

 

 

I was indeed able to get exact replacements from China on Ebay. These are Rubycon type MFZ electrolytic capacitors rated 2700uF 6.3V. That has certainly cured most of my problems, though not all of them.

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