Dell XPS 9360 - Multiple Monitor Setup

If you want a simple answer, I'll ask some more questions before providing a recommendation so as to avoid giving you a bunch of possibilities.  I've written replies like that in the past, in fact you may have come across them.  So here goes:

- What resolution(s) do you want to run on these external displays?  You say you're happy to run them at the default resolution as the 9360, but there's really no such thing.  If you won't be using the 9360's built-in display while you have you external displays active (which you shouldn't if you can avoid it), then the 9360's resolution doesn't come into play.  And the 9360 has two built-in display options anyway, namely FHD/1080p and UHD/4K.  The resolution(s) you want to run on your external displays will affect the possible options for connecting them, since higher-end display setups might require higher-end equipment.  For example, using Thunderbolt 3 equipment allows you to tap into twice as much video bandwidth as a basic USB-C cable, and 4x as much video bandwidth as is available with a USB-C docking station.  If you're not sure what resolution you want to run, then what size displays do you want?  If you're going dual 24", then FHD/1080p is the typical choice.  If you're going dual 27", then QHD/1440p is the typical choice.  Having recently upgraded from dual 24" to dual 27", I can say that it's quite nice for a home office setup if you have the desk space and budget for them.  A single 27" QHD display gives just enough size and resolution to allow you to see two 8.5x11 pages side-by-side in Word or Acrobat, in their entirety (margins and all), in either portrait or landscape orientation, at actual print size (i.e. you can hold up a physical sheet of paper to the display and it's the exact same size) -- and still have room for the application's menu bars, etc.  That's a powerful capability.

- Are you absolutely sure you don't want a dock?  If you don't have one, at the very least you'll end up having to plug your power adapter in separately.  But then if you want to use an external keyboard and/or mouse, you might have to plug those in, or a wireless receiver for them (unless they're Bluetooth).  Then you might need a USB hub if you have other external peripherals you want to use, and if you have external speakers you have to connect that cable too.  But if you've already thought of all that and are sure you just want a way to connect displays, then I'll make one or more suggestions once you let me know about your desired resolution/size.

@raidx  looks like you posted a couple replies while I was posting mine.  I'll briefly address the questions/points you raised and then I'll be happy to answer any follow-ups based on the recommendations I made above or the answers I'm posting here:

Bandwidth to the displays is an important consideration, which is why I asked about the display resolution(s) you'd be running.  But I just gave you some possibilities there, so let me know what you think of those.

If you want to use a keyboard and mouse but don't want a dock, the options I mentioned above might appeal to you because you can plug things into the display's built-in USB ports.  And with the USB-C options, you still only have a single cable coming down to the 9360.  If you ever needed more peripherals than that, you'd probably be better off just having a USB 3.0 hub and plugging that into the 9360's USB ports, in which case you could just just not use the display's USB ports at all.  Or you could technically plug the USB hub into a USB port on the monitor, which would then connect to the 9360.  That would be especially convenient if you had a USB-C connection down to the 9360 because now you have a lot more USB ports available but still a single cable down to the 9360.

For MTS, I think you mean DisplayPort MST.  That's a technology that allows a PC to run multiple displays independently from a single output on the system.  That's the exact technology that makes the daisy-chain setup I described above possible.  There are also DisplayPort MST hubs that essentially break out a DisplayPort or USB-C port (which uses DisplayPort for video) into multiple DisplayPort or HDMI outputs.  That latter option is handy if you have displays that do not have a built-in output to set up a daisy chain, but if you haven't bought displays yet, it's easier to just buy displays that have native support for daisy-chaining so you don't have to buy a hub.

The 9360 can support dual 4K external displays (with the right peripherals/cables) regardless of which built-in display it has.  But if you don't want 4K then that's fine.  I'm not particularly a fan either given that Windows still doesn't handle display scaling all that well, so when an app works with 4K, it looks great.  But when it doesn't, it can look pretty bad.

As for dual smaller displays vs. a single larger one, I would strongly recommend the former.  First of all, the total number of pixels you'll get in the former set up is almost always more, and by a larger margin.  Second, it's usually ALSO cheaper.  And third, I find that in a productivity context, being able to segment applications across different displays helps with my "mental segmentation" compared to having to arrange everything on a single large canvas.  For example, the keyboard shortcuts and "snap" functionality built into Windows that allow you to quickly have an app take up half a display works great with dual "normal size" displays because you can rapidly get 4 apps up that way.  When you have a single huge display, that's not as useful because you can only get 2 apps rapidly set up that way and they're probably larger than they need to be.  The only exception would be if you were in a job where you used a single application that would span both displays, such as a video editor working on huge timelines, in which case not having bezels separating your workspace would be convenient.  Otherwise, I greatly prefer having different displays for different apps.

I'm also not 100% convinced on doing 2x 20-24 inch monitors or just getting one huge 30 inch one.

My goal is to be able to have 2 full windows open (outlook, excel, acrobat, or Powerpoint) so I can work in one while referencing the other and the setup I have in my office at work is 2 x ~20 inch monitors. I'm used to that, but if it's better to just get one larger / nicer monitor, that's an option that works too.

Thanks for the prompt response - I have definitely read many of your suggestions, but I get a bit confused when we start talking about the bandwidth of monitors, the size of the power base on the dock, MTS (still don't know what that is), etc.

To answer your questions:

1) I'm not opposed to a dock, I just don't want to spend $200 on a dock if I can get what I need for $75 via splitters / converters. My plan is to hook up a keyboard + mouse, but I will never add speakers. The laptop has two USB slots so now that you bring it up, a dock may be a better alternative. My concern with the docks is that the TB16 is very expensive and the WD15 seems to have only 1 connection per type (1 HDMI, 1 VGA, 1 mDP, etc.) so it leads me to think that I'll need to connect each monitor with different cables, which I want to avoid for consistency in display. Again, I'm not opposed to a dock, I'm open to the idea if it makes more sense.

2) As far as the display size / resolution, I'm thinking I will do two monitors on the smaller side (24" for example), I haven't yet decided on those. However, I don't need a really large monitor or 4K display (my laptop is not the 4K version so I'm not sure if it can even output in 4K), I'm simply working with Excel / PowerPoint, browsing the internet, so while I would be willing to splurge a bit for a higher resolution than the minimum / average, I don't need the highest end available. I'm looking to spend ~$150 on each monitor, so maybe that informs the quality / type I will be purchasing. I would love advice on this front as well, I'm not sure which monitors I'm going to buy as again its quite a confusing space with a lot of technical terminology (IPS, 144hz, etc.)

Thanks for your help!

@raidx  I ended up doing some research on displays anyway.  Regardless of the display setup you want to run, the easiest way to cable them is via daisy-chaining, which means you connect your 9360 to Display #1 and then connect Display #1 to Display #2.  Your 9360 will still be able to see both displays and manage them independently, i.e. they will NOT have to be mirrored (though they can be if you ever want that).  So the next choice is of course what displays you want to use.  All of the options below have the necessary hardware to allow a daisy-chain configuration and they're roughly the same cost, but they have their pros and cons, so I'll break those down for you:

Dell P2419HC -- This is pretty standard "office-grade" 24" 1920x1080 display.  When I say "office-grade", I mean it's got a no frills look and no gaming or image professional features you don't need, but some handy productivity-oriented features you might like, such as an height-adjustable stand and built-in USB ports.  It also has a USB-C input, which means that if you used the USB-C cable included with the display to connect your 9360 to Display #1, that single cable would carry video, USB data (if you use those USB ports) and even power.  It's sort of a docking station solution without the dock.  You would then use the DisplayPort cable, also included with these displays, to connect Display #1 to Display #2.  You will probably have to go into the display's on-screen setup interface to turn on DisplayPort MST mode (or DP 1.2 mode) to get daisy-chaining working, but that's easy.

Dell U2419HC -- This is essentially the same display as above but with a somewhat higher-end panel that has a wider "color gamut", which means it can accurately reproduce a broader range of colors.  It's not on the level of a image professional display or anything, but considering that it's not much more expensive than the P2419HC, you might want to spring for it.  The cabling setup would work exactly the same as I just described above.

Dell U2415 -- This is a 24" 1920x1200 display, not the more common 1920x1080 as found above.  1920x1080 has sort of taken over these days because that resolution and proportion matches TVs, and therefore allows TV shows and most movies to be viewed without any black bars on such displays, but the extra vertical real estate of 1920x1200 is nice for a productivity setup.  It doesn't sound like much of a difference, but it really is.  Unfortunately, this display does not have a USB-C input (Dell doesn't make any 1920x1200 displays that do), so with this display, you would have to buy a USB-C to DisplayPort cable to connect to Display #1, then use the included DisplayPort cable to connect Display #1 to Display #2.  This would mean you wouldn't have USB data or power coming from that single cable running to Display #1.  Instead, you'd have to keep the 9360's power adapter separately, and if you wanted to use the display's built-in USB ports, you'd also need to connect a USB 3.0 cable from Display #1 down to your 9360.  The cable for that is included, but now that's 3 cables to connect.  But again, you get arguably a more productivity-oriented setup.

Dell U2719 -- This is a 27" 2560x1440 display.  The big difference here is of course the extra size and resolution.  The cabling setup for this display would be the same as the U2415 I described above.  There actually is a U2719DC that has a USB-C input, but the problem there is that if you want to run two of these displays, you won't be able to use that cabling setup.  Without going too far down a rabbit hole, when you use a USB-C connection that carries both video and USB data, the USB data takes away some video bandwidth, to the point that there isn't enough to run dual 2560x1440 (whereas dual 1920x1080 or dual 1920x1200 is fine).  When you instead use a USB-C to DisplayPort cable, the entire USB-C connection is being dedicated to video, which means you'll have enough video bandwidth leaving the 9360 to run two of these -- but you lose the single cable "docking station without a dock" convenience.  But of course you gain a lot more display real estate.

@jphughan thank you very much for your insights - I've learned more reading these replies than in hours of research.

A few questions:

1) If I use option one or two of your display suggestions (P2419HC for example), how would the monitors be powered? I understand I would plug int my 9360 via USB-C to Monitor A then use the displayport cable to connect Monitor A to Monitor B. But how would powering them work? Would I need three outlets? One for my laptop and one for each monitor?

2) If I look at different monitors, what do I need to look for to make sure the daisy-chain setup works? In other words, what do I need to look for in a monitor to make sure I can just plug in via USB-C from my 9360 and then just connect the monitors to each other? Is it the "Display Port MST"? Can this be done with HDMI in some monitors or you NEED to use the displayport cable?

3) I agree with you regarding the two monitor setup so I'll move forward with that

Great - thanks for the thorough and useful explanations.

At this point, my biggest question is: what's the benefit of a dock vs. the setup you are suggesting. If I'm understanding correctly, one of my options is:

1) I purchase two P2419HC monitors. Then I can plug in a mouse and keyboard to a monitor (or to my laptop) and I need just two connections (in addition to power): 1 USB-C cable from laptop to Monitor 1 and then 1 displayport cable from Monitor 1 to Monitor 2. 

2) If I purchase a dock, I would connect my mouse / keyboard to the dock, then connect the dock to one monitor and one monitor to the next one. Besides maybe one less power connection, it doesn't seem like I'm really getting any other benefit, its more expensive, and its clunkier..

@raidx  the monitors would each need to be plugged into an electrical outlet.  If you're using the USB-C option with the P2419HC or U2419HC, then Display #1 would provide power to the 9360 over that USB-C cable, drawing from its own power supply that was connected to the wall, so technically you wouldn't need to keep the 9360's own power supply handy anymore.  If you used the U2415 or the U2719D where you were using a USB-C to DisplayPort cable instead, then the monitor would not be able to provide power to the 9360, so you'd have to keep the 9360's own AC adapter around and plugged into an outlet.  But you can of course plug all of these devices into the same surge protector.

In terms of daisy-chain support, you need a display that has a DisplayPort output, which will sometimes be called a DisplayPort MST output since it's used for MST purposes.  This is admittedly fairly rare, although Dell's it's more common than average on Dell's business-oriented displays.  To use DisplayPort MST, you have to use native DisplayPort along the entire chain.  USB-C works because a USB-C cable carries a DisplayPort video signal, and you can use adapters/cables to switch between DisplayPort and Mini-DisplayPort if needed based on the displays/inputs you're using, but you cannot use HDMI, DVI, VGA, or anything else.  MST only works when all displays are "speaking" DisplayPort.  But HDMI and DisplayPort are both digital video signals and as such will look completely identical to each other.  DisplayPort is actually more advanced in terms of the amount of bandwidth it can carry and the fact that it supports MST.  If you think someday you might want a way to send HDMI from your 9360, I would recommend buying a separate USB-C to HDMI adapter or cable and keeping that handy somewhere else.  If you get a USB-C to HDMI 2.0 cable/adapter, you'll be able to send a 4K 60 Hz signal in case you might find that handy for connecting to a 4K TV in the future, for example.

@raidxto answer your questions:

To answer Question #1, if you're going to use a USB-C display, which will allow you to have a single cable that carries video for both displays, enough power for your 9360, and USB data from whatever peripherals you plug into your displays (you can even run a USB cable from Display #2's output into a USB port on Display #1 to daisy chain USB too, by the way), then in your case a dock would add little to no value over that setup.  If that's all you want to know, jump down to my answer to your Question #2.  But if you're curious, a dock would come in handy for other situations, such as:

a. You need to use things like wired Ethernet, external speakers, and/or HDMI/VGA displays.  Built-in wired Ethernet isn't available on displays (although I guess you could plug a USB Ethernet adapter into a USB port on the display), audio output headphone jacks are only available on some displays (including the U2419HC incidentally, but not the P2419HC), and HDMI/VGA displays can't be used in a daisy-chain setup, so connecting multiple non-DisplayPort displays without a dock becomes tricky in that case.  You could use an MST hub plus some adapters to work around that limitation (some MST hubs have built-in converter chips to allow sending non-DisplayPort signals, which is possible because an MST hub is essentially acting as a splitter rather than trying to send everything down a chain), but using an MST hub means your USB-C port is now being used purely for video, which means you're no longer getting USB data and power over that connection.

b. You need to run displays with a resolution higher than 1920x1200.  As I mentioned above, you can't run dual 27" 2560x1440 displays if you have a USB-C connection to Display #1 because there isn't enough bandwidth in that setup, which is why you'd need to use a USB-C to DisplayPort cable instead.  But at that point once again you lose USB data and power over that connection.  And if you wanted to run dual 4K displays, you'd need hardware that tapped into Thunderbolt rather than just regular USB-C.  So if you wanted to run display setups like that while still carrying USB data and power on the same cable, you'd need a Thunderbolt dock between your system and your displays.

c. Your system required more power than the display provided over USB-C.  The USB-C displays I mentioned above can provide up to 65W to the attached system.  That's fine for the XPS 13 9360, which only requires 45W, but systems like the XPS 15 for example require 130W.  Some Dell docking stations can provide that.  So once again, if you want everything to be carried over a single cable, including adequate power, in that case you'd need a dock.

To answer Question #2, if you just want to run dual 1920x1080 displays, you'll be using a USB-C display (i.e. not the 1920x1200 U2415), and you just need to connect some USB peripherals, then don't get a dock.  A dock actually wouldn't save you any power connections -- you'd actually be adding one, because the dock itself requires power.  You'd end up having to plug both of your displays and your dock into wall outlets.  By comparison, if you just have dual P2419HCs or U2419HCs, you'll just need to plug each display into power, and then Display #1 will supply power to the laptop over USB-C.  At that point you'd be able to keep the 9360's own power adapter somewhere else, such as your living room or permanently in your laptop bag for travel, or whatever.  If on the other hand you want to run dual 2560x1440 displays (or dual U2415s, which don't offer USB-C), then adding a dock would allow you to have a single cable connection to your laptop that carries video, USB, and power, which wouldn't be possible otherwise.  By comparison, if you skipped the dock and instead a direct daisy chain setup with displays like that, you'd need to connect the USB-C to DisplayPort cable for video, your laptop's power adapter for power, and then a USB cable for USB data from the display's built-in USB ports (or a USB hub or whatever).  So that's now three cables to connect and disconnect when you come and go with your laptop rather than one.  But how much is that single cable convenience worth to you?  And again, this assumes you even go with 2560x1440 displays or dual U2415s at all.

Lastly, whatever you do, just remember that if you set up a daisy chain, you will likely need to manually enable MST mode or DisplayPort 1.2 mode in the display's on-screen setup menu.  I mention that because I believe Dell still ships their displays with that function disabled by default, so I don't want you to freak out if you connect everything and your second display doesn't work (or only allows itself to be set up in mirror mode).  Also remember that depending on the displays you get, you may need to select different inputs on each display.  With the P2419HC or U2419HC setup, Display #1 would need to be set to the USB-C input, but Display #2 would be set to a DisplayPort input, since you'll be using a DisplayPort cable to connect Display #1 to Display #2.

Hopefully this helps.  Good luck!

Awesome - thank you so much!

Another question to make sure I understand, if I end up not going the route of a USB-C monitor (I'm noticing they're a bit more expensive), is the move buying a USB-C to displayport converter, then plugging my laptop to Monitor 1 with with a displayport cable and then connecting Monitor 1 to Monitor 2 with another displayport? I understand power won't be transferred back to my laptop, but that's fine. 

In this scenario, will I lose any display capability (ability to extend vs. duplicate) or the ability to plug USB items into the monitors? Also, in the scenario above, is it doable at all with an HDMI connection?

@raidx  if you don't use displays that have native USB-C, then yes you'd have to do what you described, although you don't need a USB-C to DisplayPort converter plus a DisplayPort cable to connect to Display #1.  There are USB-C to DisplayPort cables, like this one that I use myself for my own daisy chain setup with dual Dell U2717D displays (the predecessor to the U2719D I mentioned above).  It's a simpler and cleaner solution.  But then yes you'd use a DisplayPort cable to connect Display #1 to Display #2.

As I said earlier, you can only use DisplayPort if you want daisy chaining.  If you want to use HDMI, you'd be looking at a USB-C DisplayPort MST hub that supported DisplayPort to HDMI cables/adapters on its outputs.  Or there might be USB-C to Dual HDMI adapters as well, although I haven't looked into that.  But if they existed, they would essentially be a DisplayPort MST hub with built-in DisplayPort to HDMI converter chips, since the signal coming out of the USB-C port on the laptop is always DisplayPort.  I'm not sure why you're so concerned about HDMI, though.  It's very easy to find displays that have DisplayPort, and in fact on cheaper displays it's actually more common to find DisplayPort than HDMI because HDMI ports actually require the manufacturer to pay a royalty for every HDMI port they install onto a product, whereas DisplayPort is a royalty-free standard.  But those cheaper displays also tend to lack things like height-adjustable standards, built-in USB ports (or they might just be USB 2.0 ports rather than 3.0), and they might have cheaper TN-style panels rather than the nicer IPS panels.  TN panels have fairly poor color reproduction and wash out when viewed off-angle.  And of course in this solution you're now paying for the MST hub and additional cables/adapters or a theoretical USB-C to Dual HDMI adapter on top of the displays.

I suppose one thing you could do to save a little money would be to get a USB-C display only for Display #1, since you don't need a native USB-C input for Display #2.  So for example you could get a P2719HC and a P2719H.  The lack of a "C" on the end of the latter's model name indicates it doesn't have a USB-C input.  It also drops the DisplayPort output for a VGA input, but you don't need a DisplayPort output on your second display.  But as of this writing, there's only a $20 price difference between those two displays on the prices on the Dell US website.

I would say that if you'll be content to use dual 1920x1080 rather than 1920x1200 or 2560x1440, the additional convenience of having a single cable connection to your laptop for everything is worth the extra cost of getting at least one display that has a USB-C input and a DisplayPort output for daisy-chaining, and then a second display that has a DisplayPort input.  Also consider that displays typically have very long lifecycles compared to other electronics -- I used my dual 24" displays for about 8 years, and if I hadn't decided that I wanted dual 27" displays I could've kept on using them probably for a few more years -- so the extra cost will be amortized over a long period of time.  You'll also enjoy the single cable convenience many, MANY times over that period, whereas you'll forget about the extra cost shortly after you spend the cash.  Having to connect and disconnect three cables rather than one might not sound like much, but if you'll be doing it often, believe me it gets old fast.  I personally have a five-cable setup (display daisy chain, power, two separate USB connections, and speakers), but my laptop only ever leaves my desk a few times per YEAR.  Also remember that a USB-C display solution means you'll free up your 9360's power adapter to be used somewhere else, such as parked in another room of the house where you might use your laptop often or kept permanently in your laptop bag, which is a nice convenience too.  Again, having to unplug your power adapter and put it in your bag every time you leave and then unpack it and plug it back into your home office outlet every time you return to your desk gets old fast.

One other thing (I can't edit posts for some reason): what's your take on refurbished items from Dell? You mention these monitors have long life-spans, so I'm curious.

If I go with your suggestion of getting a P2719HC (Monitor A) and a P2719H (Monitor B), let me make sure I understand: 

1) Both monitors have the same exact display capabilities (i.e., will look the same) and look the same. The main difference is Monitor B does NOT have a USB-C port. 

2) I would plug my 9360 into Monitor A with a UBS-C cable and then plug Monitor A to Monitor B with a displayport cable.

3) If I understand correctly, there is no benefit to getting two HC monitors since I'll be plugin Monitor A to Monitor B with a displayport cable anyway? The only benefit is if i ever want to (for some reason) plug Monitor B with a usb-c cable?

If so, I think this is my best solution.

thanks for the reply.

I appreciate the fact these only depreciate slowly over a long time horizon I'm just trying to shop for the best deal for a USB-C monitor and the P2419HC that you suggested are ~$215 each, which is a bit pricey.

I'll keep looking and see what I can find. thanks again for your help

@raidx  as long as the display is well built, displays in general have long useful lifespans simply because display technology doesn't advance (and therefore get obsoleted) nearly as fast as laptops, smartphones, etc.  That's especially true for the office productivity use case since the display advances that DO occur tend to be for use cases like gaming (G-Sync/FreeSync, high refresh rate, ultra fast pixel response time) and movies (HDR).  Incidentally, speakers are another great example of long lifecycle products for the same reason.  When I was in college I paid $425 for a Logitech 5.1 THX surround sound speaker setup.  I sold that speaker set about 5 years later for $375.

My wife and I together have owned 9 Dell displays in total and we've never had one break.  We've always ended up just deciding to upgrade.

As for refurbs, I've bought some items from the Dell Outlet and they've been indistinguishable from brand new units, and in fact in many cases Dell will give you the option to buy the same full warranties that they offer on new products if you're concerned.  In the past sometimes specific Outlet items might be noted as having cosmetic damage (dings, scratches, etc.), but if they don't specifically say that, it should look basically brand new.  And sometimes it literally is brand new, because some items end up in the Outlet because the order was cancelled after the unit already entered production but before it actually shipped out, although that's admittedly less likely to be the case with displays as opposed to laptops that might be built to order if the model offered full customization of its specs.  Anyway, I wouldn't hesitate at all to buy from the Outlet if you find a good deal.  But if you do, jump on it, because the Outlet inventory turns over quickly.  That also means that if you don't immediately see what you want, check back often, because it might be there not long after.  But again, once you see it, act fast.