pwabrahams

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pwabrahams

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December 4th, 2021 14:00

Manipulating the partition table

Dell understandably does not support users mucking around with the partition table, but that should not preclude users from discussing that subject with one other.  To that end, I will describe one way of doing that.  You need to boot into a system such as any Linux version that provides a virtual environment in which you can run software that can operate on your hard drive.  That environment treats the hard drive as an external device.  I've already done this with a Kubuntu installation memory stick.  In that case I choose to try Kubuntu rather than install Kubuntu.  The environment that results operates outside of the hard drive's memory.  In particular, you can run a partition editor such as gparted.

I'm thinking of trying an experiment where I zero out all of memory and then do a factory reinstall.  I don't if it will work, but it ought to.

What led to explore this topic is a situation where none of the factory install images I've gotten from Dell support have worked. The most likely cause is a corrupted partition table, and the procedure I describe offers some hope of allowing the factory reinstall to move forward.  Needless to say, there's no information in the machine that I need to save.

  • jphughan

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    Posted December 8th, 2021 11:00

    @pwabrahams  The Ubuntu entry in your boot list is a registration in your UEFI firmware.  Windows makes one as well.  You can go into your BIOS Setup by pressing F2 and choosing to remove it if you want.  But that isn't the source of your problems.  But if you try following the steps I posted above -- adding NOTHING to them that you think might be necessary -- and you still have problems, then I will say for the third or fourth time now that you'll need to be more specific about the problem you're having.  Just saying "the process aborted after starting Setup" isn't specific.  Exactly how far did you get in the process, i.e. what was the last thing you clicked on or saw on screen?  And what exactly does "aborted" mean?  Does that mean an error message of some kind?  If so, what did it say?  Or did you system spontaneously reboot?

    I'm really trying to help you here, but you continue to do things that have no real resemblance to what I'm suggesting, while providing information that is far too vague to understand what's going on in order to help troubleshoot.

  • jphughan

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    Posted December 4th, 2021 21:00

    @pwabrahams  Have fun with that. I’ve always found it easier to just create bootable Windows installation media directly from Microsoft and then delete all existing partitions on disk before installing that fresh. Simpler than mucking around with Linux, gives me a better end result IMHO than using Dell’s factory restore mechanism that might be hugely outdated by the time I needed to use it, and has never failed me. But to each his own.

  • pwabrahams

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    Posted December 5th, 2021 09:00

    Could you say more about how to use bootable installation media from Microsoft without a product key?  Having done such an installation, is it possible to then reinstall a Dell factory image?

  • jphughan

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    Posted December 5th, 2021 11:00

    @pwabrahams  You just use the Microsoft Media Creation Tool to create the bootable media.  When you boot your system from that media and step through Windows Setup, you can choose to skip entering a product key, and then you'll have to choose which edition of Windows you want to install (Home, Pro, Education, etc.) and you'll have to activate it later.  But if your system has a Windows product key embedded into its firmware, which the vast majority of systems made over the past decade or so will have, then Windows Setup will automatically detect the embedded key and install the appropriate version.  In terms of reinstalling a Dell factory image afterward, I really don't know, but it seems a bit pointless to perform a clean install of Windows only to replace it with some other Dell factory image.  I'm guessing you're contemplating this as some sort of repair operation for this partition table corruption you're theorizing.  I personally think you're wrong that partition table corruption is the most likely explanation for being unable to use the Dell factory image, but that's not really worth me getting into.  But for anyone who feels competent performing a clean install, I really don't see the point of using the factory image at all even if it does work, for the simple reason that the factory image is likely to be older than the latest release of Windows available you can get from Microsoft at the same time.  So if you start with the factory image, you'll end up losing a bunch of time waiting for Windows to update, and probably for a bunch of drivers to update as well.  By comparison, if you start with Microsoft media, you'll get the latest release of Windows 10 or 11 as your starting point, and although you won't have any Dell-specific drivers, you can just install Dell Update to get those in an efficient way.  And that way you'll be starting with the latest available drivers rather than waiting for an outdated factory image to load and then waiting again for everything to update.

  • pwabrahams

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    Posted December 5th, 2021 16:00

    I'm trying to understand the relationship between the Media Creation Tool and the Windows 10 Media Creation Tool, since I see references to both.  I need something that will either install Windows 11 or generate an image that will do that, relying on information in nonvolatile memory to provide the necessary validation information.  I thought that a Win10_21H2_English_s64.iso USB stick might actually install Windows, but it doesn't on my machine; it starts Setup but almost immediately gets stuck because a media driver that the computer needs is missing. I think that's because the installer makes assumptions about the state of  the machine that in my case are not satisfied. That's what led me  to consider screwing around with the partition information.

    What got me into this pickle was something I did shortly after the machine arrived: I tried to install Kubuntu by just loading its installation medium.  That gave me a fine Kubuntu but caused Windows to become inaccessible.  Bad move! Every attempt I made to correct the problem only got me deeper into the mud.

  • jphughan

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    Posted December 5th, 2021 17:00

    @pwabrahams  The Media Creation Tool as far as I recall debuted with Windows 10.  I may be wrong, but there are Media Creation Tool applications for the current release of Windows 10 as well as the current release of Windows 11.  You would download the one that's designed to prepare installation media for whichever version of Windows you're trying to install.  I'm not sure what's going on with the media driver issue based on your problem description.  There just isn't enough detail there to allow for any real troubleshooting.  But as general guidance, if your system is in RAID mode, you will likely need to supply the Intel Rapid Storage driver during Windows Setup, specifically using the "Load Driver" function that becomes available at the phase of the install process where you're asked where you want to install Windows.  If your system is in AHCI mode, you should be able to skip that.  If that isn't enough, I would gently suggest that if you want assistance, you spend a bit more time providing clear and specific problem descriptions, possibly including screenshots and photos, and less time sharing your assumptions as to underlying causes of said problems.

    But if wiping your system and starting completely from scratch at this stage is an option for you, then I'd suggest downloading the Media Creation Tool for whichever version of Windows you want to use, running that to generate a bootable flash drive for that release, putting your system into AHCI mode if it isn't already, booting your system from that flash drive, and then stepping through the Windows Setup wizard.  At the point where you're asked where to install Windows, delete all existing partitions until the ONLY entry shown for that particular disk is "Unallocated space", and go from there.

  • pwabrahams

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    Posted December 6th, 2021 08:00

    I've gotten confused by the several similar names for these Tools.   Could you provide the file names (a template is OK) for the interesting ones? I've had the experience of downloading a Tool, only to discover that it's already in my toolbox.

  • jphughan

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    Posted December 6th, 2021 10:00

  • pwabrahams

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    Posted December 7th, 2021 11:00

    In order to load any of those successfully, I need a machine state that allows the image to get to the first screen where the  choice of the target partition appears.  That's why I'm focusing on getting an uncorrupted partition table.

    One thing that still concerns me: is it sufficient to have an uncorrupted partition table, or do  I need a working EFI partition as well?  If so, how do I create it?

     

  • jphughan

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    Posted December 7th, 2021 11:00

    @pwabrahams  No you don't.  If you create Windows install media using those tools, you can boot your system from that media even if the disk is marked completely empty and uninitialized.  You don't need any pre-existing EFI partition.  In two of my previous posts in this thread, I specifically suggested that at the point where you're asked where to install Windows, you first delete all existing partitions and then proceed only when the sole item in the list for that particular disk is "Unallocated space".  So again, you don't need any pre-existing partitions to allow Windows Setup to perform a new clean installation.  If you're somehow having a problem where you can't even get the list of existing partitions to appear in Windows Setup, then when you first boot that install media, BEFORE you start proceeding through the wizard, press Shift+F10 to open Command Prompt.  At that point you can use diskpart to select the target disk and run the "clean" command to mark it as completely empty and uninitialized -- at which point you won't have any partition table corruption issues to contend with.  I do this on a regular basis when performing clean installs and it works perfectly fine, so if you're still having some problem, once again I will suggest that you be specific about the exact problem behavior you're seeing, including screenshots or specific error message text, rather than just making claims that you believe to be true based on your experience.