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Replaced E7450 mSATA drive, but can't use it with external enclosure
I replaced my original mSATA SSD with a Samsung SSD and that is working perfectly, but I was hoping I could use the original mSATA SSD with my external usb hard drive enclosure. Nothing sees this drive unless it's back in it's original installation. Does the mSATA to SATA converter only work with the original laptop for some reason. Let me know if anyone has found a solution to this.
U2CAMEB4ME
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June 30th, 2020 08:00
@jphughan and @bgthoreson
Connected the mSATA caddy to the internal SATA on my Optiplex 990 and booted.
Both Sentinel and Disk Manager see the drive.
I just measured the voltage of the E7450 HDD connector and 3.37V is preasent.
I also tried installing the caddy in around 12 other laptops.
4 laptops did not see the drive in the BIOS. "Older laptops???"
So in conclusion a SATA to USB cable will not work as the caddy is using 3.3V from the laptop.
It is not converting 5V to 3.3V so it needs a dedicated 3.3V and a simple SATA to USB connector does not provide the needed 3.3V.
Regards,
U2
U2CAMEB4ME
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June 27th, 2020 09:00
Welcome to the Dell Community @bgthoreson
Are you using this caddy???
Best regards,
U2
bgthoreson
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June 27th, 2020 10:00
Yes I have the mSATA still in it's caddy. I've tried it in 2 external enclosures with no luck, so I even tried putting it internally connected in my Dell Precision T3610. Each time my Linux distro can see the device but not the disk. So normal partition utilities can see a storage device /dev/sdc, but not do any type of partitioning on it.
U2CAMEB4ME
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June 27th, 2020 11:00
@bgthoreson
Sorry but it will not work.
You must remove the mSATA from the caddy and find an mSATA to USB external enclosure.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/External-mSATA-SSD-to-USB-3-0-SuperSpeed-Converter-Adapter-Enclosure-Case/293111017565?hash=item443ec7305d:g:Ew0AAOSw7kFecwbv
I have tried to test and DOD erase them just connecting it using a SATA to USB connector.
Sorry it will not work.
I have hundreds of the extra caddies.
Best regards,
U2
jphughan
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June 27th, 2020 15:00
@U2CAMEB4ME I'm not sure why you'd claim that an mSATA to SATA caddy can't be used with a SATA to USB adapter. There's no reason that would be inherently impossible. As the OP pointed out, the caddy worked fine to turn that mSATA SSD into a regular internal SATA device used by a regular internal SATA controller, so it should do the same for a SATA to USB adapter that expects a regular SATA device.
@bgthoreson If you've only tested SATA to USB adapters that rely on USB power, one possibility is that USB power isn't enough for both the SSD and the electronics built into the caddy. There are powered SATA to USB adapters/enclosures since those are required for using 3.5" drives (desktop-class), but they're less common these days. I have one by StarTech that can operate with or without external power, so that when using a device that doesn't require such power, you don't have to connect its included wall adapter. But it's quite a bit more expensive than typical USB-powered adapters.
jphughan
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June 27th, 2020 16:00
@U2CAMEB4ME I guess there's always the possibility of something weird/proprietary going on, but mSATA SSDs work functionally identical to 2.5" SATA SSDs. mSATA is just a standard for physical size and pin mappings, but the data interface works the same way. And as a result, there are lots of mSATA to SATA bridge boards to facilitate that type of connection. So if whatever caddy the OP is using can be physically connected to a SATA port on a SATA to USB adapter, it doesn't make sense to me why it wouldn't WORK like a regular SATA SSD at that point -- unless maybe there's a power issue as can exist when using 3.5" drives with such SATA to USB adapters, as I mentioned.
U2CAMEB4ME
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June 27th, 2020 16:00
@jphughan
The caddy in question is for the E7440/E7450.
If you take the caddy "Pictured above" with the mSATA drive still mounted and use a SATA to USB it will not work!!! "Not Detected"
I just upgraded my Sentinel and I have a bucket of E7450 drives to test.
Most of the time I would have one of the tech's remove the mSATA drive and use a mSATA to USB to test them.
That's why I have hundreds if not thousands of just the caddy.
In the past I have used Sentinel and MHDD and both have not detected the mSATA without removing it from the caddy???
I'll let you know what I find on Monday,
Best regards,
U2
U2CAMEB4ME
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June 29th, 2020 05:00
Good morning @jphughan and @bgthoreson
As I stated not claimed, if the mSATA drive is in the E7440/E7450 caddy it will not be seen if using any SATA to USB connector.
It must be removed and you must use an mSATA to USB enclosure. "FACT"
As stated I new I had a bucket of E7440/E7450 mSATA's to test.
When connected and the mSATA is still in the caddy Sentinel and Disk Manager do not see the mSATA.
This was from experience not just a "Claim" that's why as I stated I have hundreds if not thousands of just the caddies as the mSATA must be removed to be tested and erased.
Best regards,
U2
jphughan
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June 29th, 2020 07:00
@U2CAMEB4ME Out of curiosity, did you try any SATA to USB adapters that had external power connected rather than just relying on USB bus power?
bgthoreson
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June 29th, 2020 08:00
I tried the caddy in my T3610 using the internal power and data cables with no luck so it's got to be a caddy issue. I've got a msata convertor showing up tomorrow so I'll know more by late Tuesday.
U2CAMEB4ME
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June 29th, 2020 08:00
@jphughan
No I have never tried.
As the power requirements for the mSATA is 3.3V ~ .7A
Most regular HDD's require 5V ~ .75A~1.25A
I use the same setup for all.
After testing around a million drives over the last 20 years I can safely say it is not a power requirement.
.
@jphughan If you live in the US I can ship a few for you to do some testing.
Regards,
U2
jphughan
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June 29th, 2020 09:00
@U2CAMEB4ME I understand the typical power requirements, but the mSATA to SATA adapter board might be the unknown here that changes the power requirements, which is why I asked if you had ever tried a powered adapter such as one that you'd use if you were trying to get a 3.5" SATA disk connected via USB. There has to be something that accounts for your findings, because mSATA to SATA bridge boards exist and are designed to cause an mSATA SSD to be usable just like a regular SATA device -- and SATA to USB adapters are designed to handle regular SATA devices, which is what the mSATA to SATA adapter should be creating. So it just doesn't make sense that these Latitude adapters would work perfectly fine when installed internally but would be impossible to get working through a SATA to USB adapter. The Latitude adapters aren't using some sort of proprietary connector within Latitude systems, after all. They're just connecting to SATA, so it shouldn't matter whether that SATA port is located inside a Latitude laptop or a SATA to USB adapter. And the only difference I can think of here is the amount and/or voltage of the power available. A SATA power connector has pins for 3.3V, 5V, and 12V. So maybe the Latitude adapter is designed to use a voltage level that your unpowered adapters aren't providing. In that case, total wattage wouldn't be relevant here.
You really don't have a powered SATA to USB adapter to try? Don't you ever need to connect 3.5" SATA drives via USB?
U2CAMEB4ME
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June 29th, 2020 12:00
@jphughan
Sorry but I had another project that needed to be sorted.
CF-31W MK4 MIL BIOS with BIOS password and BIOS microcode set to not allow WiFi and Bluetooth.
Thanks to Grub and Python I can now reset any CF-31 MK4 BIOS password and enable the WiFi and Bluetooth.
Now back to the mSATA.
I was able to remove my Master Driver drive from its enclosure. “It is the only one I have that has a separate power source.”
I clipped some of the plastic tips from the mSATA caddy and was able to fit it.
Then tried connecting it to one of my test beds and there was no difference.
After reading your last reply “3-4 times” I may have something.
Let’s see.
Regards,
U2
U2CAMEB4ME
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June 29th, 2020 12:00
@bgthoreson
How many wires does the power cable have in the T3610???
Is one of the 4~5 Orange???
Regards,
U2
jphughan
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June 29th, 2020 13:00
@U2CAMEB4ME I really don't know, but a difference in the power rails that are provided seems like the only possible answer here. Even if you don't have a powered USB to SATA adapter, what about installing the caddy into a desktop PC?