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February 20th, 2021 09:00

Aurora R4, 875W PSU, Quadro RTX 4000?

Quick question regarding wanting to swap out Dual Nvidia GTX 690s. Understand it'll be straight forward to go with 10 series (as far as I can see from a quick search they are none existent though). I've even seen a couple of examples pushing toward an RTX 2070 (although one person basically retained the R4 Aurora ALX case but swapped out all the internals). But again... availability/prices.

I'm looking at much more recent cards: i.e. Quadro RTX 4000.

Specifically:  https://www.dell.com/en-uk/shop/nvidia-quadro-rtx-4000-8gb-3x-dp-1x-virtual-link-rt-cores-tensor-cores-precision/apd/490-bfcy/graphic-video-cards

Is this specific card only for Precision Work Stations or would it actually be possible to install it in my Alienware Aurora R4? 

If it is specifically for Precision Work Stations only would I be able to go 'off-brand' say install a PNY Quadro RTX 4000?

If I can get away with just having to pay for the graphics card instead of an entirely new computer, I'd rather do that tbh.

Here's what I'm working with...

Case
R4 ALX Chassis

PSU
875W Multi-GPU Approved Power Supply

Mother Board
Alienware 07JNH0-A02 X79  x16 PCI Express Lanes A11 BIOS

CPU
i7-3960X 3.30Ghz 6 Cores | 2011 LGA 

RAM
16GB 800Mhz DDR3 DRAM (Quad Channel)

GPU
Dual NVIDIA GTX 690

OS
Windows 10 Pro - 64bit - Build 20H2

In 2019 I swapped out the original HDD with a 2TB Samsung 860 Pro SSD.

This year I bought a new monitor, an LG UltraFine Ergo (currently running perfectly well at 3840 x 2160 60hz but only via DisplayPort 1.1) using the miniDP out port on the GTX 690 switching the monitor to DP 1.2 causes the screen to go crazy and start flickering so keeping nice and stable using 1.1.

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February 20th, 2021 10:00

Quadro cards are designed for server/workstation in contrast to GeForce cards for consumer gaming.  Quadro tends to be much more expensive due to higher standard components for 24/7 server operation that cannot fail.  That is why it is used for Precision line.  It is not designed for gaming.

You may sample Aurora R4 user benchmark to get a sense what others use for gpu.

11 Posts

February 20th, 2021 11:00

1. Quadro cards are designed for server/workstation in contrast to GeForce cards for consumer gaming. 
You're assuming I'm looking to play computer games. I use my computer for work purposes. Main software regularly used, Adobe Illustrator, Xd, In-Design, Photoshop, Dimension, After Effects, Premier Pro & Media Encoder. My computer isn't 'always' on - but I'd say 6am to 12am regularly is how often it's on. So, not 24/7 ... 18/7.

2. Quadro tends to be much more expensive due to higher standard components for 24/7 server operation that cannot fail.
With the market in the shape it currently it's just as affordable as say an RTX 3070 from a scalper, if not actually cheaper than the vast majority of 3080/3090 series cards

3. That is why it is used for Precision line.
Hence the reason why I mentioned if the originally linked Dell card was specifically ONLY for the Dell Precision 3640XE / 3640 Tower workstations, then would an off-brand card like PNY (which is £65 more on Amazon) be ok? As RTX Quadro 4000 cards are not only for the Precision line.

4. It is not designed for gaming.
no way!?

Thanks however for the benchmark link. 

All I wanted to know is can I upgrade my, by todays standards, very limiting 2GB graphics card - aside from the fact it's lasted out so long - to much a newer card (and in the case of the linked Quadro simply and mainly because it's available right now).

8 Professor

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February 20th, 2021 11:00

The Quadro lineup is designed for accuracy and precision in the output, whereas the non-Quadro RTX cards are designed mainly for speed and are less accurate and thus unsuitable for many professional rendering needs.  They also have more features not relevant to gaming. 

Both are built on the same architecture so you could use a Quadro card for gaming, its just extremely cost prohibitive when  compared to a comparable non-Quadro card.  This is why basically nobody really buys Quadro cards with the intent to use it just for gaming.  I realize with the global shortage the economics of it might not be as much if you can't find any GPUs in stock anywhere.  

The other things to look for in your GPU search are size (will it fit), PSU requirements (with 875W you are good for most high end GPUs), connectors required,  and design (blower vs open air).  The maker PNY, MSI, DELL (MSI or PNY rebrand) isn't as important.

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February 20th, 2021 13:00

I get what you are saying, but when it comes to overall system performance you need a balance between the components.

In your case, a card like the RTX 4000 will be held back by your CPU and memory.

Your various professional software solutions will be held back by memory and SSD speeds.

Here's a link to relative performance measured with various benchmarks of the RTX 4000 and various non professional video cards: https://www.servethehome.com/nvidia-quadro-rtx-4000-review-a-versatile-ai-and-professional-gpu/3/

 

Personally I would buy a complete new work station with the RTX 4000 in it, much more system ram, at least 1 NVMe SSD, 16 core or higher CPU. 

It would provide a much better balance between professional and gaming use than upgrading your "old beater" with an RTX 4000.

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February 20th, 2021 16:00

I learned a lot from everyone’s perspectives.

re: Main software regularly used, Adobe Illustrator, Xd, In-Design, Photoshop, Dimension, After Effects, Premier Pro & Media Encoder.

it seems you would benefit more from a powerful multicore cpu for workstation than high end gpu to upgrade from X79 in Aurora R4.

upgrade to Ryzen zen3/2 platform or similar Intel X299 series might cost around $1000, similar to RTX4000, which I am not yet convinced you really need.

comparison of quadro RTX 4000 vs GeForce RTX 3080.

these are completely different animals.  While you can use high end quadro for gaming, it is like wearing a designer business suit attending a rock concert.

I do not know a lot of modern high end quadro, but I have a work issued quadro (I think P4000) that is great for supporting up to four 5k monitors for business video application, but not fast at all for modern games.

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February 21st, 2021 08:00

@redxps630  @r72019  @Vanadiel  I appreciate all your feedback. Thank you for taking the time out of your days to do so.

Following what everyone has said - we can categorically agree an RTX Quadro 4000 is complete overkill for my current system.

You are all correct. I genuinely need to upgrade my whole system. For context Last December I completed a client project. A 20 second 4K 3D animated render (scaling, lighting, texture mapping, etc. etc.) took poor old dual 690 2.5 hours to render). Rough cuts before sign off at 1080 took around 20/25 mins to shift out the door. The CPU was hovering around the 60/70 percents whereas both the GPUs were really going for it. I can render through software (via the CPU) but I didn't even want to try that through After Effects. I sparingly use software rendering for Premier Pro and even then exporting a simple timeline can really bump up encoding times, I work with proxies so this mitigates the load until final export. I do try to favour the cuda cores on the graphics card... a lot of Adobe's stuff is optimised (I don't know if that's the correct word) for cuda cores/Nvidia cards. So I've read / and experienced.

So, on one side of the coin I just don't care about the machine's gaming ability, what it was or what it could be. On the other hand I do care about how quickly I can get work out of the door. So if computer game graphics cards are built for speed - it's speed I'm really looking for - it's ok if I have to render out twice if the first attempt fails for whatever reason but it's only 4 mins both attempts. Instead of three quarters of an hour for the same 2 attempts currently.

I understand that everybody's saying just get a whole new work station. I mean, sure, I completely agree... I've already pretty much found a couple I've book marked that I think would be great for me moving forwards, plus from a local company to me... literally down the road from me.

https://www.scan.co.uk/products/3xs-gwp-me-q120c-intel-core-i9-10900k-32gb-ddr4-8gb-nvidia-quadro-rtx-4000-1tb-m2-ssd-2tb-hdd-win-10

or

https://www.scan.co.uk/products/3xs-rtx-studio-pro-g116r-amd-ryzen-7-5800x-32gb-ddr4-10gb-nvidia-rtx-3080-1tb-m2-ssd-2tb-hdd-win-10


However, the reality is, is that, that kind of thing can come down the line (I mean we're talking tail end of the year) once I've saved up for it. Right now, right in this moment, I just can't afford a completely brand new rig. I'm also not interested in taking a line of credit out on it. Another reason why I'm searching for just a graphics card and trying to get as much as possible out of this system.

I wrote a whole load of other responses last night - but after taking time to think about it I think the most affordable way forward is to go on eBay and find either a 1080ti or a 2070 Super and pay around £400 to £500 for it. Which, right now, I can afford. In the background I can save for a completely new Workstation.

FYI Prior to all this scalper nonsense, silly me was deliberating over a 1660 (just for some perspective on where my head was initially at - pre it being near impossible to find a graphics card from retail) I was looking for a "sensible" / affordable upgrade. If only I bought one for £320 back then?!?! 

I would take a 1080, a 2070, even a 3070 (but good luck getting one separate from a system) or even a 1660 super (8GB) 

Saying that I did find this, this morning: https://www.lenovo.com/gb/en/accessories-and-monitors/graphic-cards/graphic-cards/GRAPHIC-BO-TS-NV-RTX2070-Super-Graphics/p/4X61A22495?cid=gb:sem|se|msn|g-uk-shopping-pla-brand-accessories|||e|361527753|1178677353186550|pla-4577266909636055|shopping|shopping&msclkid=8e216fef20fc19f006d20fdd5122ca91

Can't think of any reason why it wouldn't work in my Alienware, but at almost a grand we're, rightly, back to a discussion of why not just get a new system entirely instead of spending that much on one component that's going to be nerfed by the processor and ram?!

I don't want to go with a 6GB upgrade - because I just think 2GB (4GB dual/SLI) up to 6 is just well, kind of a meh upgrade.

If I were to go for a Quadro card for my current set up - after some investigation it probably would be in fact a P4000, bit older... still extremely good. Can buy from retail still.

But like I said I think to cover potentially up to the tail end of 2021: modest spend limit of 400-ish > eBay > 1080ti/2070 super > temporary upgrade until new Workstation purchased > resell GPU to claw a few pennies back.

That's a fair approach right?

Even before I press 'Post' I can hear you all saying "just buy a new system" 

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