Call Dell, E-mail Dell, if you know Michael Dell e-mail him...
I don't think this was intentional, but regardless of intent this is deceptive marketing. Nowhere in the literature of my m6300 that I received did it mention that VT-x would not be supported. I bought my laptop with the intent to run VMs on it. Now, I'm crippled because Dell doesn't support it in BIOS and automatically sets it to "off".
If they stated clearly in the product information that VT-x would not be available or supported in your model, then it would be your own fault for buying a computer that doesn't support it. At least with mine I know it wasn't anywhere, and the Intel processor and chipset used in my laptop clearly support it and that was splashed all over the product literature.
Come one dell, update the BIOS and activate this feature for us...
kellycone, "and the Intel processor and chipset used in my laptop clearly support it and that was splashed all over the product literature." * Where on the Dell site does it state this?
bdfranson, I do not see Virtualization Technology listed as a feature of the Dimension E510 processors? Where on our site do you see this? (Processor main features = Enhanced Intel SpeedStep Technology, Intel Extended Memory 64 Technology, Hyper-Threading Technology, Intel Execute Disable Bit)
1. You're looking at the Dell site today. I'm anal retentive and have a printed copy of my product specs and information from 2 years ago when I purchased my M6300. Personally, I don't care what the site claim or does not claim today since I didn't buy it today... In my not so pristine copy, there is a ton of information about the processor spec that I picked (T9500) and what it supports. This is word for word:
Dual Core
Enhanced Intel Speedstep® Technology
Intel® EM64T 1
Intel® Virtualization Technology
Execute Disable Bit 2
Even better, on the specs for the Mobile P45 Express chipset it ALSO has VT-b as a technology. It's in two places, not one!
2. No where in my literature does it specifically state that the M6300 BIOS and configuration supports all the Intel Virtualization features. I'm not making that claim at all. However, in the case of other hardware configurations on the site, where a particular feature of the hardware is unavailable due to the configuration of the laptop, we get a nice little asterix and associated footnote warning of said incompatibility. No such warning exists in this case. If you're attempting to claim that by not explicitly stating it is supported that it is not supported, then let me give you some examples of what else isn't explicitly stated as being supported: (A litle tongue in cheek here...)
Dual Core - I can't find anything now saying the M6300 will actually run with both cores active. I guess I can't expect both cores to operate now can I?
Enhanced Intel Speedstep® Technology - Ditto again, no claimed support of speedstep in the current tech specs for the M6300, Hope that works since it is a laptop!
Intel® EM64T 1- 64 what?I guess dell doesn' actually have to support 64bit processing either - thank god that is in the hands of the OS...
Execute Disable Bit 2 - Hmm, it doesn't claim this is supported either. I guess Dell can choose to ignore this without warning as it sees fit. Who needs security?
2.66 Ghz frequency: Dell could choose to run this at whatever it wanted, like 1.02 Ghz, and since it isn't specifically stated in the dell literature I'd have no reason to be angry about it.
Point being, there is a TON of stuff you don't officially state is supported but that everyone assumes is supported. If Dell is going to take the "if not stated, not supported" strategy then you'd better start adding a ton of fine print to your product pages, and fast...
3. Any reasonable professional putting together a computer build is aware that these features exist in this processor. While you site currently does not make the same mistake of showing Intel VT-x technology in the m6300 configurator, it still doesn't make clear that VT-x isn't supported. As fas as I'm concerned this is one of two things: A simple mistake or deceptive marketing. Not being a Dell employee I'm not qualified to judge which it is...
Of course, one way Dell can "fix" this is to put a note on their product pages stating specifically that VT-x and VT-b are not supported in Dell BIOS options for the models where it is not supported. Of course, this will only help consumers making purchasing decisions in the future, and kind of throws those of us that made purchasing decisions in the past into the kettle (Which would be a great way to loose customers). It would also represent a decision to ignore one of the key technologies in a current CPU. Why any computer company would choose to disable one of the primary features of a CPU is a bit beyond me, but if that is the decision so be it. I'll have to recommend we purchase another company's mobile workstations next year when we're up for new machines...
Personally, I don't give a rat's rear end which it is. I bought a computer that at the time of purchase mentioned Intel's advanced virtualization technology in at least two places in the product literature, albeit it was the literature specifically related to the particular hardware not to the M6300 in general. The implication was that Virtualization was a feature of this laptop, and I seriously doubt you can argue that it is an unrealistic interpretation. Given this, I expect Virtualization to be enabled or have the option to enable it on this computer. I'm posting these comments in hope that Dell will fulfill that expectation since they are the ones that initially set it.
The implication was that Virtualization was a feature of this laptop, and I seriously doubt you can argue that it is an unrealistic interpretation. Given this, I expect Virtualization to be enabled or have the option to enable it on this computer. * I know on the Desktop side, we would not add this feature after we released the PC. You should contact the Laptop liaison (DELL-Bill B) and ask him. Also, you might want to post this discussion on the Laptop General Hardware board.
Already posted on the laptop board, I had done a search for the issue on the whole forum after turning up nothing in the laptop board, and upon finding this topic I thought I'd add my two cents...
PETER345
5.8K Posts
0
August 9th, 2006 01:00
Peter
kellycone
4 Posts
0
June 16th, 2009 10:00
Call Dell, E-mail Dell, if you know Michael Dell e-mail him...
I don't think this was intentional, but regardless of intent this is deceptive marketing. Nowhere in the literature of my m6300 that I received did it mention that VT-x would not be supported. I bought my laptop with the intent to run VMs on it. Now, I'm crippled because Dell doesn't support it in BIOS and automatically sets it to "off".
If they stated clearly in the product information that VT-x would not be available or supported in your model, then it would be your own fault for buying a computer that doesn't support it. At least with mine I know it wasn't anywhere, and the Intel processor and chipset used in my laptop clearly support it and that was splashed all over the product literature.
Come one dell, update the BIOS and activate this feature for us...
DELL-Chris M
Community Manager
•
56.9K Posts
0
June 16th, 2009 12:00
kellycone,
"and the Intel processor and chipset used in my laptop clearly support it and that was splashed all over the product literature."
* Where on the Dell site does it state this?
bdfranson,
I do not see Virtualization Technology listed as a feature of the Dimension E510 processors? Where on our site do you see this?
(Processor main features = Enhanced Intel SpeedStep Technology, Intel Extended Memory 64 Technology, Hyper-Threading Technology, Intel Execute Disable Bit)
kellycone
4 Posts
0
June 16th, 2009 13:00
Chris,
1. You're looking at the Dell site today. I'm anal retentive and have a printed copy of my product specs and information from 2 years ago when I purchased my M6300. Personally, I don't care what the site claim or does not claim today since I didn't buy it today... In my not so pristine copy, there is a ton of information about the processor spec that I picked (T9500) and what it supports. This is word for word:
Even better, on the specs for the Mobile P45 Express chipset it ALSO has VT-b as a technology. It's in two places, not one!
2. No where in my literature does it specifically state that the M6300 BIOS and configuration supports all the Intel Virtualization features. I'm not making that claim at all. However, in the case of other hardware configurations on the site, where a particular feature of the hardware is unavailable due to the configuration of the laptop, we get a nice little asterix and associated footnote warning of said incompatibility. No such warning exists in this case. If you're attempting to claim that by not explicitly stating it is supported that it is not supported, then let me give you some examples of what else isn't explicitly stated as being supported: (A litle tongue in cheek here...)
Point being, there is a TON of stuff you don't officially state is supported but that everyone assumes is supported. If Dell is going to take the "if not stated, not supported" strategy then you'd better start adding a ton of fine print to your product pages, and fast...
3. Any reasonable professional putting together a computer build is aware that these features exist in this processor. While you site currently does not make the same mistake of showing Intel VT-x technology in the m6300 configurator, it still doesn't make clear that VT-x isn't supported. As fas as I'm concerned this is one of two things: A simple mistake or deceptive marketing. Not being a Dell employee I'm not qualified to judge which it is...
Of course, one way Dell can "fix" this is to put a note on their product pages stating specifically that VT-x and VT-b are not supported in Dell BIOS options for the models where it is not supported. Of course, this will only help consumers making purchasing decisions in the future, and kind of throws those of us that made purchasing decisions in the past into the kettle (Which would be a great way to loose customers). It would also represent a decision to ignore one of the key technologies in a current CPU. Why any computer company would choose to disable one of the primary features of a CPU is a bit beyond me, but if that is the decision so be it. I'll have to recommend we purchase another company's mobile workstations next year when we're up for new machines...
Personally, I don't give a rat's rear end which it is. I bought a computer that at the time of purchase mentioned Intel's advanced virtualization technology in at least two places in the product literature, albeit it was the literature specifically related to the particular hardware not to the M6300 in general. The implication was that Virtualization was a feature of this laptop, and I seriously doubt you can argue that it is an unrealistic interpretation. Given this, I expect Virtualization to be enabled or have the option to enable it on this computer. I'm posting these comments in hope that Dell will fulfill that expectation since they are the ones that initially set it.
DELL-Chris M
Community Manager
•
56.9K Posts
0
June 17th, 2009 10:00
The implication was that Virtualization was a feature of this laptop, and I seriously doubt you can argue that it is an unrealistic interpretation. Given this, I expect Virtualization to be enabled or have the option to enable it on this computer.
* I know on the Desktop side, we would not add this feature after we released the PC. You should contact the Laptop liaison (DELL-Bill B) and ask him. Also, you might want to post this discussion on the Laptop General Hardware board.
kellycone
4 Posts
0
June 18th, 2009 07:00
Already posted on the laptop board, I had done a search for the issue on the whole forum after turning up nothing in the laptop board, and upon finding this topic I thought I'd add my two cents...
Thanks for the suggestions.