I use Ghost and had aconfiguration problem due to my own error.  Have you done any alterations to the system since you bought it?

Please note that Ghost is not going to let you backup (image) anything from and to the same partition.  Are you using a CD or DVD drive to backup or another drive/partition?

I have not altered the configuration at all. The system is running perfectly and is starting to get older, that's why I want to image it now, before something happens. I installed a second hard-drive specifically for the purpose of backing up the main drive. I've built several systems successfully and have them networked currently, so I'm no novice. I've never encountered this sort of partition before, though I have heard of it. I have a feeling that if the partition is removed the drive will refuse to boot. I was hoping someone on this forum had encountered this problem before and may know of a workaround to imaging the drive.

Which version of PQ DriveImage are you using? 

I have DriveImage 2002 and have used it successfully several times on the Dell Dimension 4550 that I have.  My configuration also has the hidden no drive letter FAT partition as well as yours along with C: in NTFS and 2 other partitions I created on the same drive.  I think earlier versions of Drive Image did not work with XP.  Also when you boot in DOS you say it is not really DOS as DOS can not see NTFS partitions only FAT.  So make sure you are not using a win 9x or ME bootdisk. DriveImage 2002 uses Caldera DOS which works with NTFS volumes if that is what you have.  In addition there is an issue with DriveImage in that it will not run if certain files within DriveImage have been compressed by the XP disk cleanup (NTFS only).

On the three Dell pcs that I have, NONE of them came installed with a CD burner that was compatible with either Ghost or Drive Image. Thus the drive was not recognized by Ghost.  I installed a Plextor CD-RW on one and it worked just fine. 

The easier solution which I have found is to create a second partition on the main hard drive.  Then create your clone images to that drive.  This is both faster and easier than burning to CDs.

Message Edited by oldtraveler on 03-06-2004 09:39 AM

Imaging to a partition *is* the easiest but least secure. You lose your HD and ALL partitions are gone. CDRs are good or if you can afford it and have Ghost an external HD would be the best. That's my thinking on it.

I tried Driveimage Pro 6.0. When it boots to Caldera DR DOS it does not see the drive ID for the main drive. What version of Driveimage did you use? I read online where Powerquest was bought out by Symantec so the online support is pretty bad.

This afternoon I tried using the Utilities that came with the WD drive. EZ Drive was able to see the 30 mb partition and did a image of the remaining 80 gb C drive. The problem is, it won't boot. Gives me an error saying it needs an Administrator password. When I tried to do a refresh of XP it won't let me and says I need an Administrator password. Thing is, this machine has no password on it! The password is no password. So apparently Dell has put a password that is hardwired into the bios somehow and the C drive has to read it through the 30 mb partition. I tried installing a clean copy of XP onto the new drive without the Dell drive hooked up. The installation went fine. When the machine boots up it gives me a choice of which copy of XP to boot! Keep in mind, this is a fresh install with the original Dell Maxtor drive not hooked up at all. Because of this I'm pretty sure there's a bios trick going on here too. I'm afraid if I pull the mb battery for a second that when I go to boot the original drive again the password configuration it needs to boot won't be there and will hang just like the WD drive did after I installed the image of the C drive with EZ Drive.

I'd be perfectly happy to allow Dell to continue to monitor my machine with their secret password and configuration. I have nothing to hide. But I really don't want to have to re-install 50 games and 47 applications again. The machine runs great, even with all this software installed.

....and that's exactly what I'm trying to do. Image the drive and put it on an external USB drive for safe keeping.

I read some past postings on this issue and found one where the author claimed to have gotten Driveimage Pro to image the drive. He'll be in for a big surprise when he has to use it though. It won't boot without the 30mb secret partition on the drive. If he loses the drive, he's stuck with a non-bootable bunch of data and will have to re-install the OS. After re-installed the new OS won't see any of the old backed up applications or settings.

This is a real issue. Dell needs to make a utility that will allow users to image their Dell configured machines, or at least put a disclaimer on each machine before purchase time that the machine cannot be used like normal PC's.

I haven't used Drive Image (2002 v.6.0) in over a year.  I now use Ghost 2003. Symantec does now own and provide support for Powerquest products.

However, I recently had a Ghost issue that I was able to get resolved by sending a request to Symantec tech support using the following form which should work also for Drive Image.

https://support.ece.com/forms/symantec/contactsymantec.asp

 

 

Message Edited by oldtraveler on 03-07-2004 10:37 AM

Couple of comments.

DI has been known to have problems with NTFS. DI7 can copy to USB device; verify your version can before you start. My 4100 (3+ years old) with DI5 worked fine to a partition and to cdr/rws using Millenium(FAT). DI5 also copies XP (FAT) to a partition; whether the 4100 had the diagnostic FAT mini-partition on it originally I can’t say but it didn’t before I installed XP-I formatted first.

Xp sometimes will ask for the Administrator password. If you can boot to the partition’s Safe Mode, do a CTL/ALT/DEL twice, enter Administrator (capitalized ?) and leave Password field blank you may get in. Failing that I would see if this would work.

Make a partition, format it (FAT). Put XP on it. Use Transfer Wizard to copy your stuff from NTFS to new FAT partition. Then backup to USB drive. If you have to restore your C: drive you can always convert the image from FAT to NTFS if you prefer that format.

I don’t know if this idea has a ghost of a chance and I’m not familiar with the intracasies of Transfer Wizard but give it a try. No, there’s not much support for earlier DI versions but you may be able to gleen some info from these videos.
http://www.powerquest.com/support/videos/driveimage7/

 

Great site for Ghost: ghost.radidied.com

Thank you for the good advise but I think the problem has been lost in the thread. I can image the "C" drive by using WD EZ-Drive. The problem is:

1. that the image that is copied does NOT boot without the Dell 30 mb FAT configuration partition present.
2. if the Dell 30 mb configuration partition is removed, the remaining Dell "C" drive will not boot.

thus

Imaging the drive, with the 30 mb partition, is not possible.

I think I'm glad I switched to Norton Ghost 2003.

Robert1947,
I have read many posts in this forum with respect to that Dell FAT32 partition. Many have deleted it, or did a clean install of WinXP over it. Supposedly it only contains diagnostic and initial installation aids to facilitate the initial factory loading/testing of the new system. I used Partition Magic to shrink mine to 16MB (the smallest part. possible). I think the BIOS may be at fault for not being able to boot from anything other than the 'C' drive (multiple OS's being the exception).

I have solved the problem. Thanks to the good people of this board I was able to get a bootable backup of my primary Drive. First I used "Diskpart" to delete the 30 mb configuration partition. That removed, enabled me to use Ghost to do a clone of the drive. Then, I discovered, the cloned drive would not boot.........again. This time I used the trick I picked up from an earlier post for something similar. I pressed the caps lock, scroll lock, and num lock on while in the BIOS. Then I pressed ALT +E, ALT +F, and ALT +B. This reset the BIOS to detect new hardware. This did the trick, the cloned drive booted and all is well.

Many thanks to all who helped.