That is entirely up to you amp512 I do not notice the ghosting issue on the desktop - but on games its pretty obvious. Maybe I should try some sites with a dark background. Chris has already informed us that when the replacement is ready (if/when?) then we can exchange it for the new revision. Or you can return it now and get credit. I am going to wait for the new revision - and I make pickup a samsung 22" with 2ms to hold me over for games. I still have my 940BW's which were great @ 4ms. We'll see where things go.
I've been reading this extensive forum (perhaps the busiest) for a few days now to help me decide if I should hold back on purchase or dive into the mire of complaints.
Don't know if "defective" is the best category for the 2407WFP-HC if the current issue being cited has allowable fault tolerances that may be inherent with the display technology. But what is certain is that the issue has a lot of people upset. The Dell tech folks have 'declared' a root cause discovery. Okay ... so everyone is waiting on Dell to give some good news.
Can Chris M provide the readers an explanation why Dell is continuing to sell the monitor if they have admitted that a performance issue exists with the product?
I spoke with a Sales Support 2 days ago to inquire. She wasn't aware of any issue. She then conferences me into a call with Customer Service; that person wasn't aware of any issue. We were told to call Tech Support ... in that conf call, the rep said there was NO PROBLEM with the monitor. ?????!!
Fortunately, while we were waiting between dept calls, the Sales Support rep jumped onto the forum and quickly assessed the scope of customer complaints being posted. She quickly corrected the Tech Support rep stating the problem and Dell's acknowledgment that the root cause to the issue was found.
None of the departments that deal with customers seem to know about the issue.
Aside from that, I'd like to purchase the monitor as it is currently on sale. I asked Sales Support if they would honor a 'rain check' for the sale price. I could not get an answer. But I was told to expect a callback in 24 hours to advise me on my options, no call back and it’s been 48 hours.
Chris M, can you provide some insight on how this issue is being handled internally among Dell departments. I see a communication disconnect. How far up the Dell flag pole is this issue going?
Chris M, can you provide some insight on how this issue is being handled internally among Dell departments.
* We would not notify Sales, Care, or Technical Support until we formulate a plan of action. Which has not been done, yet.
I know that Chris has said that there have only been 108 reports of complaints on this monitor. I know that he has told us that they are working on it and have found the root problem, and are determining a fix. The way I see it we could be seeing one of two things. Dell could be diligantly on this to correct the issue and assure it's customer satisfaction, even though few we may be under this issue. And it may just be that this isn't an open matter in the company and no internal anouncement has been made on this issue, because of the small amount of complaints, and they don't see any reason to restrict their sales on the monitor. Or they could be stringing us a long in a manner of speaking, telling us they are working on it, promising a fix, just to keep us sated while they continue to sell a monitor that we have founded and reasonable complaints with, only to eventually come out and say that either that there is no fix, or that this problem has been deemed inside reasonable mfg tolerances. Kinda like a stuck or dead pixel. I'm not trying to attack Dell, or Chris, and I realize this is a tactic that a lot of companies have used in the past. I'm not saying this is how Dell is handling this or will handle this. I'm just saying that it is a reasonable thought on the situation. I would rather be optimistic and hope that we will see some progress on this and ultimately be satisfied.
Now my qualm with a lot of what I have seen in this thread, with people coming in, people that actually don't even own this monitor. This ghosting is not acceptable in modern LCD technology. I have owned numerous LCDs, high and low quality, and I have never, not once seen anything to this extent. This is the worst and by far most noticable defect in an LCD that I have ever seen, and I have been using LCD's for the past 6 years. It is not a byproduct of LCD technology, it is not or no where near the norm. It is not, a "sacrifice" in the price/performance issue of this monitor. There is something wrong, it is a defect, this should not be occuring. The green tint ghosting, which can be fixed by lowering the color values is acceptable, it is understandable. This is not. If you have not seen Mobius videos on this then you should google for "2407WFP-HC ghosting".
I have the 2407WFP-HC and can see the ghosting if I want to, under the right circumstances. Maybe my sample is less affected than others, but I can live with it.
However, if I was on the market today to buy a new monitor, I would
never order a 2407WFP-HC until I could be certain that the issue is fixed and that only fixed units are in the channel.
As for it being on sale...There is always another sale coming up, and the prices trend downwards.
Now my qualm with a lot of what I have seen in this thread, with people coming in, people that actually don't even own this monitor. This ghosting is not acceptable in modern LCD technology ... This is the worst and by far most noticable defect in an LCD that I have ever seen, and I have been using LCD's for the past 6 years. It is not a byproduct of LCD technology, it is not or no where near the norm. It is not, a "sacrifice" in the price/performance issue of this monitor. There is something wrong, it is a defect, this should not be occuring. If you have not seen Mobius videos on this then you should google for "2407WFP-HC ghosting".
Hey Myhre, appreciate your comments. Yes, I'm not a current owner of this product. BUT, this forum is certainly helping me make an informed decision. And for that, I appreciate the insights being shared by many.
You also raise an important point about unacceptable performance issues that should be pursued. So this begs the question that I will direct to Chris M. I am not pointing fingers at anyone, just looking for clarification. Because Dell has identified a root problem, are they admitting that the 2407WFP-HC is a
"defective product"? (Yes/No)
IMHO, at this stage of the analysis, Dell should have some conviction of how they are classifying the problem.
DimensionGoku wrote: Perhaps I am not reading this thread correctly, but when was the exact root of the problem pointed out by Dell? There is good information and possible causes posted by other people but I failed to read after 2 months when Dell announced that the cause of the ghosting was found!!!
Referring to excerpt from Message 249 posted by Chris M on 9/15/2007:
"All, ... We HAVE found the root cause and are working towards a response and/or fix with our manufacturer. IF there is another revision, you will all be able to initiate an exchange for this new revision. All I can do is await the response from our manufacturer."
It's been 12 days since the announcement. Hopefully we will hear good news from Chris M soon.
Last time they thought they found the cause of the problem (1 month ago?) , they said it was just a matter of changing some settings, however it was not true. :smileysad:
Perhaps I am not reading this thread correctly, but when was the exact root of the problem pointed out by Dell? There is good information and possible causes posted by other people but I failed to read after 2 months when Dell announced that the cause of the ghosting was found!!! They haven't even mentioned the issue in the so called dell blog. That is what I want to know for now, what is the cause of the problem or any announcement, but it seems like another month will pass by without an answer and when we get an answer (who knows when that will be) then the real wait will begin for the solution. :smileymad:
"Or they could be stringing us a long in a manner of speaking, telling us they are working on it, promising a fix, just to keep us sated while they "
continue to sell a monitor" that we have founded and reasonable complaints with, only to eventually come out and say that either that there is no fix, or that this problem has been deemed inside reasonable mfg tolerances. Kinda like a stuck or dead pixel"
Myhre I am thinking the same thing.
jaggernaut thanks a lot, I don't know how I missed that, but if that is true why after 12 days have we not been told what is causing this problem? or why has there been no announcements about it?
I think we can at least be allowed to know. It will give us some ideas on what moves to make next.
That is all I have been asking all along! Because I know that after the issue is fully recognized, the real wait will begin. :smileysad:
"* Because 98 percent of the buyers of this monitor use it in such a way that they do not see the ghosting. We cannot even produce the ghosting playing WOW in our lab."
I'm sorry but this has to be false. I notice blatant ghosting while playing WoW. Tell them to go into Scarlet Monastary, Cathedral. Once they are inside the Cathedral and have downed a few of the mobs, have them observe some of the bodies and they will be able to see the ghosting without a doubt.
And I do not believe that 98% of people buying this monitor do not notice the ghosting. More that a large amount of people may not know what it is they are seeing, or that it is a defect because they aren't as informed as others on the matter. That does not make it any less of a defect. Basing success on ignorance is not good business.
I do not understand the logic in your posts. You claim that Dell has found the root problem to the ghosting. You also claim that Dell's Tech have been unable to reproduce this ghosting in World of Warcraft. Now if you say they have been able to in other instances, then why say that they have not been able to in World of Warcraft? What is the point of that statement? You have also implied that this has now been left up to the discresion of the manufacturer of the monitor. So does this mean that all that has been done, is Dell has informed the manufacturer of the complaints and is letting them make a decision as to whether or not they will do anything about it?
Is Dell or is the Manufacturer looking into this? Is Dell just waiting on the MFG to get back with them about this? It seems to me that the further this goes on, the more defensive and curt you have gotten with Dell's
Customers. It seems that we are being told more and more often that this is not widespread and that we are few, almost implying that Dell is in no way concerned by our satisfaction in the products it brings to the market.
Quote by Chris M
"In our opinion, you can wait for the official statement."
I don't think that was a very customer service oriented thing to say.
Because Dell has identified a root problem, are they admitting that the 2407WFP-HC is a "defective product"? (Yes/No)
* No.
Last time they thought they found the cause of the problem (1 month ago?) , they said it was just a matter of changing some settings.
* I thought all I said was that we had discovered the root cause.
"All, ... We HAVE found the root cause and are working towards a response
and/or fix with our manufacturer.
IF there is another revision, you will all be able to initiate an exchange for this new revision. All I can do is await the response from our manufacturer."
when was the exact root of the problem pointed out by Dell?
* It was not. Nor will we until we know what the manufacturer wants us to release.
but if that is true why after 12 days have we not been told what is causing this problem? or why has there been no announcements about it?
* See my answer above.
I think we can at least be allowed to know.
* In our opinion, you can wait for the official statement.
What I do not understand is as they can continue producing and selling the east user product with a so serious failure and but when we are speaking of a product that indeed is not cheap in Spain surroundings to 900€.
* Because 98 percent of the buyers of this monitor use it in such a way that they do not see the ghosting. We cannot even produce the ghosting playing WOW in our lab.
I have spoken with the Technical department and they do not know anything of this.
* We would not notify Sales, Care, or Technical Support until we formulate a plan of action. Which has not been done, yet.
I have received a second monitor, also is one rev. A00 de Agosto 2007 and happens exactly the same.
What I do not understand is as they can continue producing and selling the east user product with a so serious failure and but when we are speaking of a product that indeed is not cheap in Spain surroundings to 900€.
That it happens they do not know to solve this problem?
They have not realized in department RMA of which this happening, I have spoken with the Technical department and they do not know anything of this, I I hallucinate.
I am seriously thinking about giving back the product at the most or that guarantees the change to me as soon as rev leaves one. A01 with the resolute problem.
A greeting to all.
Original en Español
Hola a todos
"Perdon esta traducido con GOOGLE"
He recibido un segundo monitor, tambien es una rev.A00 de Agosto 2007 y pasa exactamente lo mismo.
Lo que no entiendo es como pueden seguir produciendo y vendiendo al usuario este producto con un fallo tan grave y mas cuando estamos hablando de un producto que precisamente no es barato en españa entorno a los 900€.
Que pasa no saben solucionar este problema??
No se han dado cuenta en el departamento RMA de lo que esta pasando, he hablado con el departamento Técnico y no saben nada de esto, yo alucino.
Estoy seriamente pensando en devolver el producto o a lo sumo que me garanticen el cambio en cuanto salga una rev. A01 con el problema resuelto.
Myre posted that "Chris has said that there have only been 108 reports of complaints on this monitor".
I suspect that there are people like myself who are having the ghosting issue, reading the posts, but not "reporting" it. So, for the record:
I purchased the 2407WFP-HC LCD Monitor directly from Dell on 08/29/2007. The ghosting defect is a very significant problem that I wish resolved, and I am waiting for ChrisM to announce when and how I can replace the monitor with a *new*, updated version, through him, per instructions he posted earlier.
I look forward to, and appreciate, a quick resolution by Dell of this unfortunate engineering problem.
ChrisM is not Dell and he is not the manufacturer either. Everybody here is aware that Dell subcontracts its products. So for the 2407, this subcontrator has to get the Samsung panel, other components, and assemble the monitor. So that's at least a 3-layer structure to fix this problem, with the required delays for re-design and testing.
It's not as if ChrisM is manufacturing the monitor in his basement during his spare time.
ChrisM must be as anxious as all the unhappy owners here to see this fixed. I have been reading this thread since the beginning and find that he has always given precise, by-the-book answers and explained repeatedly how the process works and the options that are available to those who get a monitor they find unaccceptable.
ChrisM even pointed me to the ghosting problem and this thread when I asked another question about this monitor. The way he has treated the complaint doesn't lead me to even consider that Dell is trying to bury this.
Sorry Chris... I 've been watching this thread for a long while now and I am sure when Dell releases a fix you are going to have a heck of alot more people jumping on this then just a hundred. Maybe more like a thousand. Not to mention the many many more people waiting for a bug free version of the 2407or 2408. If wouldn t surprise me if Dell saw sales of this monitor shooting up 15-20% if you fix this bug/defect and not introduce some other bug. I have a single 2405 and am waiting for Dell to fix the 2407 so I can give the 2405 to my wife and purchase 2 2407's One for myself and one for the kids computer.
Message Edited by mackintire on 09-27-2007 09:57 PM
dhahlen
11 Posts
0
September 26th, 2007 21:00
jaggernaut
14 Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 17:00
Don't know if "defective" is the best category for the 2407WFP-HC if the current issue being cited has allowable fault tolerances that may be inherent with the display technology. But what is certain is that the issue has a lot of people upset. The Dell tech folks have 'declared' a root cause discovery. Okay ... so everyone is waiting on Dell to give some good news.
Can Chris M provide the readers an explanation why Dell is continuing to sell the monitor if they have admitted that a performance issue exists with the product?
I spoke with a Sales Support 2 days ago to inquire. She wasn't aware of any issue. She then conferences me into a call with Customer Service; that person wasn't aware of any issue. We were told to call Tech Support ... in that conf call, the rep said there was NO PROBLEM with the monitor. ?????!!
Fortunately, while we were waiting between dept calls, the Sales Support rep jumped onto the forum and quickly assessed the scope of customer complaints being posted. She quickly corrected the Tech Support rep stating the problem and Dell's acknowledgment that the root cause to the issue was found.
None of the departments that deal with customers seem to know about the issue.
Aside from that, I'd like to purchase the monitor as it is currently on sale. I asked Sales Support if they would honor a 'rain check' for the sale price. I could not get an answer. But I was told to expect a callback in 24 hours to advise me on my options, no call back and it’s been 48 hours.
Chris M, can you provide some insight on how this issue is being handled internally among Dell departments. I see a communication disconnect. How far up the Dell flag pole is this issue going?
Thanks.
DELL-Chris M
Community Manager
•
56.9K Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 18:00
Chris M, can you provide some insight on how this issue is being handled internally among Dell departments.
* We would not notify Sales, Care, or Technical Support until we formulate a plan of action. Which has not been done, yet.
Windscythe
36 Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 18:00
BernardPD
1 Rookie
•
122 Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 19:00
jaggernaut
14 Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 20:00
Hey Myhre, appreciate your comments. Yes, I'm not a current owner of this product. BUT, this forum is certainly helping me make an informed decision. And for that, I appreciate the insights being shared by many.
You also raise an important point about unacceptable performance issues that should be pursued. So this begs the question that I will direct to Chris M. I am not pointing fingers at anyone, just looking for clarification. Because Dell has identified a root problem, are they admitting that the 2407WFP-HC is a "defective product"? (Yes/No)
IMHO, at this stage of the analysis, Dell should have some conviction of how they are classifying the problem.
jaggernaut
14 Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 21:00
Referring to excerpt from Message 249 posted by Chris M on 9/15/2007:
"All, ... We HAVE found the root cause and are working towards a response and/or fix with our manufacturer. IF there is another revision, you will all be able to initiate an exchange for this new revision. All I can do is await the response from our manufacturer."
It's been 12 days since the announcement. Hopefully we will hear good news from Chris M soon.
DimensionGoku
77 Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 21:00
DimensionGoku
77 Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 22:00
Windscythe
36 Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 23:00
Message Edited by Myhre on 09-27-2007 07:44 PM
Message Edited by Myhre on 09-27-2007 07:48 PM
Message Edited by Myhre on 09-27-2007 07:51 PM
DELL-Chris M
Community Manager
•
56.9K Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 23:00
* No.
Last time they thought they found the cause of the problem (1 month ago?) , they said it was just a matter of changing some settings.
* I thought all I said was that we had discovered the root cause.
"All, ... We HAVE found the root cause and are working towards a response and/or fix with our manufacturer. IF there is another revision, you will all be able to initiate an exchange for this new revision. All I can do is await the response from our manufacturer."
when was the exact root of the problem pointed out by Dell?
* It was not. Nor will we until we know what the manufacturer wants us to release.
but if that is true why after 12 days have we not been told what is causing this problem? or why has there been no announcements about it?
* See my answer above.
I think we can at least be allowed to know.
* In our opinion, you can wait for the official statement.
What I do not understand is as they can continue producing and selling the east user product with a so serious failure and but when we are speaking of a product that indeed is not cheap in Spain surroundings to 900€.
* Because 98 percent of the buyers of this monitor use it in such a way that they do not see the ghosting. We cannot even produce the ghosting playing WOW in our lab.
I have spoken with the Technical department and they do not know anything of this.
* We would not notify Sales, Care, or Technical Support until we formulate a plan of action. Which has not been done, yet.
cpcuesta
8 Posts
0
September 27th, 2007 23:00
“Translated Pardon this with GOOGLE”
I have received a second monitor, also is one rev. A00 de Agosto 2007 and happens exactly the same.
What I do not understand is as they can continue producing and selling the east user product with a so serious failure and but when we are speaking of a product that indeed is not cheap in Spain surroundings to 900€.
That it happens they do not know to solve this problem?
They have not realized in department RMA of which this happening, I have spoken with the Technical department and they do not know anything of this, I I hallucinate.
I am seriously thinking about giving back the product at the most or that guarantees the change to me as soon as rev leaves one. A01 with the resolute problem.
A greeting to all.
No se han dado cuenta en el departamento RMA de lo que esta pasando, he hablado con el departamento Técnico y no saben nada de esto, yo alucino.
fearmore
2 Posts
0
September 28th, 2007 00:00
I suspect that there are people like myself who are having the ghosting issue, reading the posts, but not "reporting" it. So, for the record:
I purchased the 2407WFP-HC LCD Monitor directly from Dell on 08/29/2007. The ghosting defect is a very significant problem that I wish resolved, and I am waiting for ChrisM to announce when and how I can replace the monitor with a *new*, updated version, through him, per instructions he posted earlier.
I look forward to, and appreciate, a quick resolution by Dell of this unfortunate engineering problem.
BernardPD
1 Rookie
•
122 Posts
0
September 28th, 2007 00:00
mackintire
1 Message
0
September 28th, 2007 00:00
Message Edited by mackintire on 09-27-2007 09:57 PM