The same problem just happened again. This time I have reason to suspect that it may have resulted from simply opening the Dell Wireless LAN Card Utility window, *without* making any changes, prior to a suspend/resume cycle.
Actually, the encryption key field in both the Dell Wireless Utility and Windows' wireless configuration window are treated as password blocks (which is why it shows dots instead of the key itself). Because it is treated as a password field it will always show only 8 dots when you bring the window up, even though it will show one dot for each character you type when entering the key manually.
I'm glad to hear you got the reconnection problem fixed. It shounds like that firmware version of the router has problems with requests to continue using the same IP address (instead of a normal request asking for one).
The encryption key field is treated as a password, and thus hidden to prevent people from looking over your shoulder to get it, in most wireless configuration utilities. I can see the reasoning behind both hiding it (to prevent unauthorized people watching you connect learn it) and having it visible (so users know if it is entered correctly).
The matter of the slow transfer between two computes is actually not really that surprising, and fairly easy to explain. Wireless is considered half-duplex communication because only one "person" can talk at a time. This means that your wireless card or the router can talk, but not both together (there are technologies to get around this, but that is for another discussion :emotion-1:). When the computer talks over TCP/IP (most network traffic) it doesn't just send data, but instead has a conversation with the router for each packet sent. Basically that conversation is:
packet sent
receiver acknowledges receipt
sender acknowledges receivers acknowledgement
For small bits of data (emails, websites that don't have big images or complicated flash, etc) this data can be sent fairly quickly. However, if you are transferring more than about a megabyte of data at once, the delays due to having to wait for the "other person" to finish talking get noticable to us humans. If you then add in another wireless computer things get more complex because the router can still only talk when the computers aren't, and now it has to talk to two computers, and the computers can't talk at the same time. What this leads to us the transfer taking a lot longer than if you used a network cable.
Thanks very much for that info Larry. After further investigation, the apparent problem with the passwords doesn't appear to have really been a password problem at all. It looks like there are some rather serious bugs in the firmware for my Linksys WRVS4400N wireless router that cause problems with DHCP requests for wireless connections under certain scenarios. Apparently, re-entering the password in the Dell utility triggered some kind of difference in the connection process that allowed the DHCP request to complete successfully, while it didn't otherwise.
For reference in case anyone else encounters similar issues: When I initially encountered this problem, the WRVS4400N firmware was at version 1.01.03, which is the latest version currently available from the Linksys web site. However, later beta versions are available from Linksys tech support (be prepared to wait on hold for a long time and get shuffled between several different reps). I was able to locate firmware version 1.01.08 at LinksysInfo.org, which appears to have corrected the DHCP issue. But I am still getting extremely SLOW data transfer speeds (on the order of 50 times less than normal) when copying files between two computers both having wireless connections to this router. If either computer is connected via a wired connection, then I see more reasonable data transfer speeds. This router appears to have some very SERIOUS problems, and I am extremely disappointed in it so far. This is the second router in a row that I have purchased from Linksys with very serious quality control issues. If I buy one more thing from them with similar results, that will be the LAST Linksys product that I EVER buy. These royally up routers have already caused me way more trouble and taken up far more of my time than they are worth.
Meanwhile, I apologize for mistakenly identifying this issue as apparent problem with the Inspiron 1720, Dell Wireless 1505 adapter, or related software. However, it would have been very helpful in diagnosing the problem I had been able to actually see the password that was being used. In my opinion, there is no good reason to hide this value from an administrative user, other than to prevent observation by someone else nearby. For situations like mine where I am the ONLY person who could possibly view the screen or do anything else to this machine, there should be an option in the Dell software to enable viewing of the password at ALL times, not just when entering it in the first place. My $0.02 worth...
The slow data transfer that we are experiencing with this router is VASTLY slower than what we experience between two wireless connected machines using other routers. Slower by a factor of roughly 20 times. And slower than one computer on wireless to one computer on cable by about 50 times. There are definitely some very serious problems with this router. I just got off the phone with a Cisco/Linksys tech support rep, and he agreed that the data transfer speed that I am getting (around 250 kbits/sec) is at least 10 times slower than it ought to be. He is about to send me another firmware update to 1.01.13 and I will see if that helps...
If you are counting the dots in the password box, you should know that it is not an accurate count. It always shows only about 8 dots, no matter how long your password is. Mine is over 25 characters and shows 8. Re-entering the correct password just refreshes it and reminds Windows and reconnects. PS WEP is not good security and you should use WPA or WPA2 if your card supports it.
Linksys could provide no additional assistance. Said they tried a similar configuration and could not replicate the problem. Meanwhile they have come out with a V2 iteration of the WRVS4400N router. Prelminary users of that router are reporting other problems (overheating, high pitched whine emanating from router, etc.). Sounds like maybe Linksys fixed the software only to have hardware issues in the new version...
kamyers1
1 Rookie
•
11 Posts
0
December 9th, 2008 16:00
The same problem just happened again. This time I have reason to suspect that it may have resulted from simply opening the Dell Wireless LAN Card Utility window, *without* making any changes, prior to a suspend/resume cycle.
Larry R
2 Intern
•
1.7K Posts
0
December 10th, 2008 07:00
Actually, the encryption key field in both the Dell Wireless Utility and Windows' wireless configuration window are treated as password blocks (which is why it shows dots instead of the key itself). Because it is treated as a password field it will always show only 8 dots when you bring the window up, even though it will show one dot for each character you type when entering the key manually.
Larry R
2 Intern
•
1.7K Posts
0
December 10th, 2008 08:00
I'm glad to hear you got the reconnection problem fixed. It shounds like that firmware version of the router has problems with requests to continue using the same IP address (instead of a normal request asking for one).
The encryption key field is treated as a password, and thus hidden to prevent people from looking over your shoulder to get it, in most wireless configuration utilities. I can see the reasoning behind both hiding it (to prevent unauthorized people watching you connect learn it) and having it visible (so users know if it is entered correctly).
The matter of the slow transfer between two computes is actually not really that surprising, and fairly easy to explain. Wireless is considered half-duplex communication because only one "person" can talk at a time. This means that your wireless card or the router can talk, but not both together (there are technologies to get around this, but that is for another discussion :emotion-1:). When the computer talks over TCP/IP (most network traffic) it doesn't just send data, but instead has a conversation with the router for each packet sent. Basically that conversation is:
For small bits of data (emails, websites that don't have big images or complicated flash, etc) this data can be sent fairly quickly. However, if you are transferring more than about a megabyte of data at once, the delays due to having to wait for the "other person" to finish talking get noticable to us humans. If you then add in another wireless computer things get more complex because the router can still only talk when the computers aren't, and now it has to talk to two computers, and the computers can't talk at the same time. What this leads to us the transfer taking a lot longer than if you used a network cable.
kamyers1
1 Rookie
•
11 Posts
0
December 10th, 2008 08:00
Thanks very much for that info Larry. After further investigation, the apparent problem with the passwords doesn't appear to have really been a password problem at all. It looks like there are some rather serious bugs in the firmware for my Linksys WRVS4400N wireless router that cause problems with DHCP requests for wireless connections under certain scenarios. Apparently, re-entering the password in the Dell utility triggered some kind of difference in the connection process that allowed the DHCP request to complete successfully, while it didn't otherwise.
For reference in case anyone else encounters similar issues: When I initially encountered this problem, the WRVS4400N firmware was at version 1.01.03, which is the latest version currently available from the Linksys web site. However, later beta versions are available from Linksys tech support (be prepared to wait on hold for a long time and get shuffled between several different reps). I was able to locate firmware version 1.01.08 at LinksysInfo.org, which appears to have corrected the DHCP issue. But I am still getting extremely SLOW data transfer speeds (on the order of 50 times less than normal) when copying files between two computers both having wireless connections to this router. If either computer is connected via a wired connection, then I see more reasonable data transfer speeds. This router appears to have some very SERIOUS problems, and I am extremely disappointed in it so far. This is the second router in a row that I have purchased from Linksys with very serious quality control issues. If I buy one more thing from them with similar results, that will be the LAST Linksys product that I EVER buy. These royally up routers have already caused me way more trouble and taken up far more of my time than they are worth.
Meanwhile, I apologize for mistakenly identifying this issue as apparent problem with the Inspiron 1720, Dell Wireless 1505 adapter, or related software. However, it would have been very helpful in diagnosing the problem I had been able to actually see the password that was being used. In my opinion, there is no good reason to hide this value from an administrative user, other than to prevent observation by someone else nearby. For situations like mine where I am the ONLY person who could possibly view the screen or do anything else to this machine, there should be an option in the Dell software to enable viewing of the password at ALL times, not just when entering it in the first place. My $0.02 worth...
Kevin M.
kamyers1
1 Rookie
•
11 Posts
0
December 10th, 2008 10:00
The slow data transfer that we are experiencing with this router is VASTLY slower than what we experience between two wireless connected machines using other routers. Slower by a factor of roughly 20 times. And slower than one computer on wireless to one computer on cable by about 50 times. There are definitely some very serious problems with this router. I just got off the phone with a Cisco/Linksys tech support rep, and he agreed that the data transfer speed that I am getting (around 250 kbits/sec) is at least 10 times slower than it ought to be. He is about to send me another firmware update to 1.01.13 and I will see if that helps...
Kevin M.
Mary G
4 Operator
•
20.1K Posts
0
December 10th, 2008 10:00
If you are counting the dots in the password box, you should know that it is not an accurate count. It always shows only about 8 dots, no matter how long your password is. Mine is over 25 characters and shows 8. Re-entering the correct password just refreshes it and reminds Windows and reconnects. PS WEP is not good security and you should use WPA or WPA2 if your card supports it.
kamyers1
1 Rookie
•
11 Posts
0
December 10th, 2008 15:00
New firmware did NOT help. Awaiting another call from Cisco/Linksys...
Kevin M.
kamyers1
1 Rookie
•
11 Posts
0
December 12th, 2008 01:00
Linksys could provide no additional assistance. Said they tried a similar configuration and could not replicate the problem. Meanwhile they have come out with a V2 iteration of the WRVS4400N router. Prelminary users of that router are reporting other problems (overheating, high pitched whine emanating from router, etc.). Sounds like maybe Linksys fixed the software only to have hardware issues in the new version...