I am sorry that I didn't see this before. Earlier switchable graphics from both AMD and Nvidia you could switch between the two cards when needed, which was pretty nice. The bad thing about it was that when you switched between the two cards the system would lose video as the one GPU was being disabled and the other was cranking up. This could possibly be as long as a minute or more.
One of the things that AMD and Nvidia have done to correct this is that now the integrated GPU never turns off. If a game or program has been configured to run in High Performance and if the AC adapter is attached, the discreet GPU will kick on and render the graphics and send the rendered graphics to the processor which will then be loaded on the game via the integrated GPU. The good thing about this is since the integrated GPU is not being turned off, there is no loss of video, and you don't have to switch to the different GPU before loading your game or program.
The bad thing is that there isn't a lot to indicate that the discreet card is even functioning. Nvidia Optimus handles this little better in that they have a little pop up that will show if the discreet card has kicked in. Even this isn't perfect though as when you are running a game full screen you aren't going to see the popup. For the most part the rendered graphics are being sent via the integrated GPU so the game doesn’t really detect the discreet GPU.
Personally I feel that the catalyst graphics should being able to communicate better that the discreet graphics is functional and give some type of indication when they are enabled. Keeping and eye open and installed the most up to date graphics is my first suggestion, I know that most of you are doing this.
As a test If possible I would like for you to run the most graphics intensive program, bench mark or game that you have available. Hopefully one that you know shouldn't run very well on just integrated graphics. First I would like for you to configure the game or program as power saving and record FPS while in the game.
Then I would like for you to close out of the game and configure it as High Performance and see if there is a change in FPS. The discreet GPU should render the graphics and send the rendered graphics to the processor is quicker time then the integrated GPU will be able to render them so you should see improved FPS even though you don’t see the discreet GPU.
Please let me know if there is a change on the performance of the games depending on how they are configured.
Thank you for explaining how switchable graphics work in this kind of laptop, but believe me that after spending a month trying to solve the problem, I think I know perfectly how they work.
Anyway, as you told, I have run FS2004 (whit bad weather) that should not run very well on just integrated graphics, and this is the result:
Have a look to the FPS--->10,5/20!!! This is unbelievable. I prefer not to imagine how does FSX run. Last week I have tried it with FSX, and directly the laptop prefers to close the software when starting a flight. As you can see in my other posts, this happends with several games or softwares. I am saying this, because I do not want to listen again that this problem is due to the software providers. This is the easy way to leave all dell Inspiron customers with our actual problem untill we buy a laptop from another mark.
I really much appreciate your interest shown in this problem, but this is not a simple problem, it would be really fine if you have the opportunity to escalate this problem to another department untill they find a solution for us or they finally create the missing driver that will allow us to use our dedicated graphic card.
In my case I have tried everything to solve it (uninstall of drivers, reinstall, updates, 3 fabric restore, to many phone calls to technical support service as you could check...) and this graphic problem still appears, it is becoming really annoying since we have spent a lot of money in something that does not work as it was supposed to.
I couldn't agree more with all the comments put on already. I bought this thinking I would have a 2gb graphics card to use on game as and when I wanted.. it would appear that the reality of it is that Dell and the laptop are controlling what I use! I feel I have been mis sold the laptop. I really do wish I had discovered this issue before hand.
Surely DELL have a duty of care to rectify this issue? Its not like we as customers are asking alot. Just the control of OUR graphics card!
I am sorry guys. I have mentioned in earlier threads I have had some hands on experience with the Inspiron 15r SE and was able to play Skyrim, and Shogun, total war 2 on mid to high settings. On the system that I had it was more than obvious that the discreet card was rendering graphics. I am frustrated that other than the fact the games was running there was no indication on either game, or anywhere else that the discreet card has kicked in.
Personally I am not a huge fan on schemes to save battery power by limiting when you can use the full power of the devices on the system, be it wireless card or video cards. Neither Optimus nor Enduro are Dell specific technologies, and are infact used Industry wide.
With that said, I have spoke to engineering in length regarding these problems especially with gamers and will continue to do so. If any of you feel that you would like to explore possible service options with the idea that they may be defective hardware with your systems please feel free to contact me via private message. In the message please include the service tag and I will be happy to research service options.
I do not question at all your experience on this model of laptop, but as a DELL customer, it is the first time I have such a problem. It is a pitty to buy a new computer spending a high quantity of money on it and see how it does not work as it should do. I can not realise that Inspiron 7520 model can not afford to run a simulator from 9 years ago on high settings, it can not even run it on medium settings. Autocad runs as if I had bought the first game boy released and Flight simulator X directly crashes. This is unbelievable.
Hope engineering department gives us a solution. It is quite easy, they only have to take a new Inspiron 7520 from the store, set everything in high performance on the AMD catalyst control center and test it. They will find that something is going wrong since switchable graphics do not work and do not allow the dedicated graphic card AMD Radeon HD 7730M function.
Anyway, even if there is not any indication showing that the dedicated graphic card is running or not, most of the softwares tell you so. For example, Autocad has a tool that let you know which graphic card is going to use the laptop, and FS (either FS2004 or FSX) is capable to do so.
Remarks: both FS and Autocad (Software for Architects) are last versions.
Terry,do you think I am able to work properly with this Intel4000 graphic card? I have purchased a dedicated 2Gb graphic card that is not available on my laptop. Before buying the computer I had even the option to improve its graphic card from 1Gb to 2Gb, but it does not matter, even spending more money, the result is the same.
Is there an alternative for us? I do not even mind to change my laptop for another one that runs, even paying for it. I just want a solution, and I think I am not exagerating the situation, since one month has passed without any news. Which is the department in charge which can help me? Support service department recognizes that there is a problem, but they agree that it does not belong to their competences. Complaints service only receives the complaint and do not act in fact.
I can completely agree with LESO same situation with me the dedicated is simply not switching over - to be honest i dont care if it doesnt show me which one is running if it was actually working properly it wouldnt matter - its obvious from the performance that its not the dedicated card kicking in as it should do based on the settings assigned in CCC. It's easy enough for someone from DELL to try themselves as you are still selling the faulty model.
Its pretty unlikely to be a hardware issue with everyone having the same issue since release the 2gb Radeon may as well not be there currently.
As I have mentioned before I have personally tested some very graphics extensive games and other than not receiving indication that the discreet GPU is not functioning (very frustrating) it was obvious that the AMD GPU was kicking in. I played a number of games with no errors, or messages. I do feel bad that you aren't seeing the same in your systems.
The offer still stands, if you would like for me to research possible service options please just shoot me a private message and in the message include your name, addres, phone and email.
As an FYI and in addition to what Terry B has stated about Discrete GPU Technology - I'm offering up the following AMD Blog Link for those with AMD Discrete cards in their system so you can better understand their "Enduro Technology".
Specifically this part:
What is AMD Enduro™ Technology? AMD Enduro™ technology is designed to unlock the full potential of your laptop’s performance while maximizing battery life. This mobile-platform technology applies to AMD- and Intel-based laptops equipped with a discrete, high-performance AMD Radeon™ graphics processor.
AMD Enduro™ technology seamlessly/automatically selects (No manual switching) the best graphics processor for a given application.
Well it supposed to work seamlessly when it ACTUALLY works (See information/links below on that subject matter)
Next... I'm not sure what the Current AMD Video Driver Version Dell is offering (their version compared to OEM's version) for your systems on their site, but as you can see from the AMD Blog, around October 2012 AMD finally decided to play catch up to what the NVidia Optiums Technology drivers have been providing and doing for the past two years for their line of Discrete GPU's
That is:
With the AMD Enduro™ technology UI update our intention was to focus on and allow:
A seamless and automatic GPU selection for the vast majority of mainstream and casual users
Provide an “Expert mode” customization of GPU selection for enthusiasts and gamers, based on specific applications and requirement for power state
Option to do away with the headaches of profile management – choose to only use the embedded graphics on battery and maximize the apps that use dGPU (Discrete GPU) when plugged in.
Prior to this date, there was no way for you to force when the system would use the Discrete GPU it was up to the Driver to make that decision and sometimes it failed to do what one expected. (Again, see my links below on a full article on the state of AMD)
So look at that Blog Link above, do you folks have that AMD Enduro Screen shown in the Blog Page included with your Dell provided driver? If not, then you aren't able to tap into that discrete card like you hope you could.
As of Jan 17th 2013 AMD Released their 13.1 Version of the Catalyst Mobility Drivers, that incorporates a lot of what that BLOG discuses but there is a caveat to all of this (isn't there always).. Note, that this AMD Catalyst Mobility driver package can only be installed on specific AMD Enduro platforms, that are second generation AMD A-series APU, or third generation Intel Core family based. I've researched the AMD HD7xxxM series for someone else, it's a London Series, Southern Island (GPU Family) GPU, which does Support Enduro Technology, everyone else you'll need to do some internet research with your google friend to ensure that your Platform(unit) is compatible.
I'm not saying that you should update to AMD's own released drivers instead of using what Dell provides, but if you do so, I suggest running the Tool that the above Driver Link mentions and doing your homework. If you brick your video/unit, it's your responsibility.
If you do decide to take the route of using AMD's own Drivers then please READ the following set of articles from AandTech before setting out on to do so, especially the Addendum Link! Again, Know your Systems Architecture, Know your GPU's, Know what you are getting into.
Last, you all may want to educate yourself to get a better understanding to what the REAL issue is with AMD, where they stand as of today, where they are going and basically how much they have had to catch back up to NVidia when it comes to Discrete GPU's in Laptop units. It's not a pretty sight, AMD is finally getting there, but they are getting there slowly.
I have provided Links below that will generally answer all the questions I have seen in this post. Like why doesn't it work the way I think it's supposed to work, or when it does work why are the frame rates so low. Why won't it use the AMD GPU instead of the Integrated Intel HD IGP, Please read the whole article as it sums up the technology nicely.
Note to those complaining about their software NOT seeing the AMD GPU, it doesn't work that way. Again, please read up on the technology to have a better understanding, a lot has changed and if you haven't had a laptop with a Discrete GPU in it you are probably at a loss on how it truly works thus causing frustrations. This is not 2 years ago I can go into my bios and turn on or off one of the Video Cards technology of yesteryear.
These discrete cards use MUX-less technology, there are no physical switches between the video adapters and the display output ports - it's what Terry B was trying to point out. The Discrete GPU's still need the Integrated Graphics Processor (Intel HD) to actually display the video.
The old MUXed systems also allowed you to basically go into the BIOS and force the Active Display Adapter because each adapter was a full graphics card, that is to say the BIOS would force an internal physical electronic switch to drive the video output from the card you chose to the video output ports. As well you could have your software do the same, IE: Go into FS X and choose the Graphics Card - this would basically force the same internal electronic switch to send the video output from the card you chose to the video output port that the display was attached to.
Where as these new Discrete GPU's are all MUX-less, they do not have a display MUX(Switch) since the the video displays are only connected to the integrated cards display outputs. On MUX-less systems, the discrete card is solely for RENDERING, not display. Your Games will only see the Integrated Graphics Processor, it is clueless to what is RENDERING the actual graphics it has no idea that the IGP or the Discrete GPU rendered the frame.
Some of the newer applications, updates and patches are now being made aware to what the DRIVER has chosen and will display that as the graphics card being used. Take for instance a few of the benchmark tools out there. If you where to go into the Catalyst Driver (see below) and physically force the application to render on a specific graphics processor the benchmark tool will display it and report on it correctly. You see a lot of people not knowing how the technology works complaining that the benchmark is using the Intel HD card and displaying stats for the Intel HD when they expected it to use the Discrete GPU instead. They all complain that they can't go into the BIOS and deactivate the card, They all complain that the Discrete Card is not working probably, They all don't understand the technology that's what is obvious.
Change the Catalyst Driver (again see my note below) to force it to send rendering to the Discrete GPU when the Benchmark software runs solves the issue. It will internally report correctly and display stats for the correct card. Applications/Games will probably be following suit, that is if they claim they will work with these newer Discrete GPU's you usually get the disclaimer on a Game stating it only works with a certain line of GPU's most taking the standard line of not compatible with mobile graphic cards/drivers. But, 9 times out of 10 if you have a decent card it works, whether they put the code logic in to display what card is being used to render the output well that's a different story.
As Terry B stated, it's a shame that AMD's Enduro doesn't display some kind of information to when it is handling the rendering for an application. The NVidia Optiums driver does for their line of discrete cards. I have a Dell 17R SE 7720 that uses an NVidia Discrete GPU, I'm able to force what application renders where, and I can see via the Optimus Driver when an application is using the Discrete Card for it's rendering. I'm not familiar with AMD, I am familiar with NVidia, but the technology is very similar so who knows perhaps AMD's 13.1 driver does this now.
So all in all... This is where it's important to have drivers that at least allow you to go into them and force applications to use the rendering engine on the GPU that you think can handle it better. Again, before the October BETA 12.11 Catalyst Drivers from AMD the driver did this at it's own discretion, if it failed to chose correctly you got stuck seeing graphics being rendered on the IGP instead. Their latest driver now offers this ability, not sure what Dell's version for your units are at, perhaps still below the OEMS reference 12.11 drivers.
This is a great post and I appreciate you taking the time.
For the rest of you Inspiron 15r SE owners that are still having problems with your games please let me know. This is new technology and until better battery technology comes around I don't see Enduro or Optimus going away anytime soon. Hopefully AMD and Nvidia for that matter will create new drivers that make it easier to create profiles for games, and have clearer indicators on what GPUs are present and working on notebooks.
Hopefully new game and benchmark creators will create their new products to correctly show what GPU are currently rendering graphics.
Any conclusion? Objective instructions? I am here with my Inspiron 15R SE with no functioning AMD 7730M. After all this, could you resume, what do I do? I am going to get my money back if that doesn't work.
Conclusion - I have mine, AMD still playing catch-up to NVidia when it comes to Discrete cards and Drivers.
Objective instructions - Trying using the AMD Drivers direct from AMD's site.
If you read the blog posting by AMD you would notice that as of 12.11 Beta they changed the Catalyst Driver in regards to now allowing you to physically select when the Discrete Rendering Engine (that being your AMD 7730M) card should be used to offload rendering from the Integrated Graphics Processor (IGP) in this case the Intel HD4000. Prior to that it was Automatic (The catalyst driver determined when, if it felt the HD4000 can handle it so it was, at least now you can force it).
Please read the links I provided they are very detailed and explain it quite nicely. - I recommend that if you do go with AMD's own Driver that you run their verification tool as to it being a good idea to do a complete system backup as well, in case you have to revert your system back.
Current Version AMD Driver is 13.1 which added the Enduro UI interface for you to select applications that should be forced.
DELL-Terry B
4 Operator
•
3.5K Posts
0
February 1st, 2013 12:00
I am sorry that I didn't see this before. Earlier switchable graphics from both AMD and Nvidia you could switch between the two cards when needed, which was pretty nice. The bad thing about it was that when you switched between the two cards the system would lose video as the one GPU was being disabled and the other was cranking up. This could possibly be as long as a minute or more.
One of the things that AMD and Nvidia have done to correct this is that now the integrated GPU never turns off. If a game or program has been configured to run in High Performance and if the AC adapter is attached, the discreet GPU will kick on and render the graphics and send the rendered graphics to the processor which will then be loaded on the game via the integrated GPU. The good thing about this is since the integrated GPU is not being turned off, there is no loss of video, and you don't have to switch to the different GPU before loading your game or program.
The bad thing is that there isn't a lot to indicate that the discreet card is even functioning. Nvidia Optimus handles this little better in that they have a little pop up that will show if the discreet card has kicked in. Even this isn't perfect though as when you are running a game full screen you aren't going to see the popup. For the most part the rendered graphics are being sent via the integrated GPU so the game doesn’t really detect the discreet GPU.
Personally I feel that the catalyst graphics should being able to communicate better that the discreet graphics is functional and give some type of indication when they are enabled. Keeping and eye open and installed the most up to date graphics is my first suggestion, I know that most of you are doing this.
As a test If possible I would like for you to run the most graphics intensive program, bench mark or game that you have available. Hopefully one that you know shouldn't run very well on just integrated graphics. First I would like for you to configure the game or program as power saving and record FPS while in the game.
Then I would like for you to close out of the game and configure it as High Performance and see if there is a change in FPS. The discreet GPU should render the graphics and send the rendered graphics to the processor is quicker time then the integrated GPU will be able to render them so you should see improved FPS even though you don’t see the discreet GPU.
Please let me know if there is a change on the performance of the games depending on how they are configured.
TB
Roberto_Sampaio
15 Posts
0
February 1st, 2013 18:00
I Have the same problem !!!
I spent 50 minutes waiting to be answered by fone and Dell didnt solve the problem..
I tried the chat and after 30 minutes waiting and, after that, plus 1 hour trying to solve the problem... And... the problem was not solved...
I cant believe Dell is doing this with the costumers...
Its a shame !!!
Roberto_Sampaio
15 Posts
0
February 1st, 2013 18:00
I was forgetting...
For me its impossible to use HDMI... No image anyway...
LESO
13 Posts
0
February 2nd, 2013 08:00
Good afternoon Terry,
Thank you for explaining how switchable graphics work in this kind of laptop, but believe me that after spending a month trying to solve the problem, I think I know perfectly how they work.
Anyway, as you told, I have run FS2004 (whit bad weather) that should not run very well on just integrated graphics, and this is the result:
Have a look to the FPS--->10,5/20!!! This is unbelievable. I prefer not to imagine how does FSX run. Last week I have tried it with FSX, and directly the laptop prefers to close the software when starting a flight. As you can see in my other posts, this happends with several games or softwares. I am saying this, because I do not want to listen again that this problem is due to the software providers. This is the easy way to leave all dell Inspiron customers with our actual problem untill we buy a laptop from another mark.
I really much appreciate your interest shown in this problem, but this is not a simple problem, it would be really fine if you have the opportunity to escalate this problem to another department untill they find a solution for us or they finally create the missing driver that will allow us to use our dedicated graphic card.
In my case I have tried everything to solve it (uninstall of drivers, reinstall, updates, 3 fabric restore, to many phone calls to technical support service as you could check...) and this graphic problem still appears, it is becoming really annoying since we have spent a lot of money in something that does not work as it was supposed to.
Regards,
tomr2992
2 Posts
0
February 2nd, 2013 09:00
I couldn't agree more with all the comments put on already. I bought this thinking I would have a 2gb graphics card to use on game as and when I wanted.. it would appear that the reality of it is that Dell and the laptop are controlling what I use! I feel I have been mis sold the laptop. I really do wish I had discovered this issue before hand.
Surely DELL have a duty of care to rectify this issue? Its not like we as customers are asking alot. Just the control of OUR graphics card!
Roberto_Sampaio
15 Posts
0
February 2nd, 2013 18:00
And HDMI still not working...
Thanks DELL...
I think you will going to lose another customer...
DELL-Terry B
4 Operator
•
3.5K Posts
0
February 4th, 2013 16:00
I am sorry guys. I have mentioned in earlier threads I have had some hands on experience with the Inspiron 15r SE and was able to play Skyrim, and Shogun, total war 2 on mid to high settings. On the system that I had it was more than obvious that the discreet card was rendering graphics. I am frustrated that other than the fact the games was running there was no indication on either game, or anywhere else that the discreet card has kicked in.
Personally I am not a huge fan on schemes to save battery power by limiting when you can use the full power of the devices on the system, be it wireless card or video cards. Neither Optimus nor Enduro are Dell specific technologies, and are infact used Industry wide.
With that said, I have spoke to engineering in length regarding these problems especially with gamers and will continue to do so. If any of you feel that you would like to explore possible service options with the idea that they may be defective hardware with your systems please feel free to contact me via private message. In the message please include the service tag and I will be happy to research service options.
TB
LESO
13 Posts
0
February 5th, 2013 02:00
Hi Terry,
I do not question at all your experience on this model of laptop, but as a DELL customer, it is the first time I have such a problem.
It is a pitty to buy a new computer spending a high quantity of money on it and see how it does not work as it should do. I can not realise that Inspiron 7520 model can not afford to run a simulator from 9 years ago on high settings, it can not even run it on medium settings. Autocad runs as if I had bought the first game boy released and Flight simulator X directly crashes. This is unbelievable.
Hope engineering department gives us a solution. It is quite easy, they only have to take a new Inspiron 7520 from the store, set everything in high performance on the AMD catalyst control center and test it. They will find that something is going wrong since switchable graphics do not work and do not allow the dedicated graphic card AMD Radeon HD 7730M function.
Anyway, even if there is not any indication showing that the dedicated graphic card is running or not, most of the softwares tell you so. For example, Autocad has a tool that let you know which graphic card is going to use the laptop, and FS (either FS2004 or FSX) is capable to do so.
Remarks: both FS and Autocad (Software for Architects) are last versions.
Terry,do you think I am able to work properly with this Intel4000 graphic card? I have purchased a dedicated 2Gb graphic card that is not available on my laptop. Before buying the computer I had even the option to improve its graphic card from 1Gb to 2Gb, but it does not matter, even spending more money, the result is the same.
Is there an alternative for us? I do not even mind to change my laptop for another one that runs, even paying for it. I just want a solution, and I think I am not exagerating the situation, since one month has passed without any news. Which is the department in charge which can help me? Support service department recognizes that there is a problem, but they agree that it does not belong to their competences. Complaints service only receives the complaint and do not act in fact.
Regards,
fish1985
8 Posts
0
February 5th, 2013 03:00
I can completely agree with LESO same situation with me the dedicated is simply not switching over - to be honest i dont care if it doesnt show me which one is running if it was actually working properly it wouldnt matter - its obvious from the performance that its not the dedicated card kicking in as it should do based on the settings assigned in CCC. It's easy enough for someone from DELL to try themselves as you are still selling the faulty model.
Its pretty unlikely to be a hardware issue with everyone having the same issue since release the 2gb Radeon may as well not be there currently.
Thanks for your continued input and chasing but
DELL-Terry B
4 Operator
•
3.5K Posts
1
February 5th, 2013 15:00
As I have mentioned before I have personally tested some very graphics extensive games and other than not receiving indication that the discreet GPU is not functioning (very frustrating) it was obvious that the AMD GPU was kicking in. I played a number of games with no errors, or messages. I do feel bad that you aren't seeing the same in your systems.
The offer still stands, if you would like for me to research possible service options please just shoot me a private message and in the message include your name, addres, phone and email.
TB
CyberMaxX360
272 Posts
0
February 7th, 2013 16:00
As an FYI and in addition to what Terry B has stated about Discrete GPU Technology - I'm offering up the following AMD Blog Link for those with AMD Discrete cards in their system so you can better understand their "Enduro Technology".
Specifically this part:
What is AMD Enduro™ Technology? AMD Enduro™ technology is designed to unlock the full potential of your laptop’s performance while maximizing battery life. This mobile-platform technology applies to AMD- and Intel-based laptops equipped with a discrete, high-performance AMD Radeon™ graphics processor.
AMD Enduro™ technology seamlessly/automatically selects (No manual switching) the best graphics processor for a given application.
Well it supposed to work seamlessly when it ACTUALLY works (See information/links below on that subject matter)
Next... I'm not sure what the Current AMD Video Driver Version Dell is offering (their version compared to OEM's version) for your systems on their site, but as you can see from the AMD Blog, around October 2012 AMD finally decided to play catch up to what the NVidia Optiums Technology drivers have been providing and doing for the past two years for their line of Discrete GPU's
That is:
With the AMD Enduro™ technology UI update our intention was to focus on and allow:
Prior to this date, there was no way for you to force when the system would use the Discrete GPU it was up to the Driver to make that decision and sometimes it failed to do what one expected. (Again, see my links below on a full article on the state of AMD)
So look at that Blog Link above, do you folks have that AMD Enduro Screen shown in the Blog Page included with your Dell provided driver? If not, then you aren't able to tap into that discrete card like you hope you could.
As of Jan 17th 2013 AMD Released their 13.1 Version of the Catalyst Mobility Drivers, that incorporates a lot of what that BLOG discuses but there is a caveat to all of this (isn't there always).. Note, that this AMD Catalyst Mobility driver package can only be installed on specific AMD Enduro platforms, that are second generation AMD A-series APU, or third generation Intel Core family based. I've researched the AMD HD7xxxM series for someone else, it's a London Series, Southern Island (GPU Family) GPU, which does Support Enduro Technology, everyone else you'll need to do some internet research with your google friend to ensure that your Platform(unit) is compatible.
I'm not saying that you should update to AMD's own released drivers instead of using what Dell provides, but if you do so, I suggest running the Tool that the above Driver Link mentions and doing your homework. If you brick your video/unit, it's your responsibility.
If you do decide to take the route of using AMD's own Drivers then please READ the following set of articles from AandTech before setting out on to do so, especially the Addendum Link! Again, Know your Systems Architecture, Know your GPU's, Know what you are getting into.
Driver Availability:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6678/amd-catalyst-131-whql-drivers-available
Driver Addendum information/caveats
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6689/addendum-regarding-amds-mobility-catalyst-131-drivers
Last, you all may want to educate yourself to get a better understanding to what the REAL issue is with AMD, where they stand as of today, where they are going and basically how much they have had to catch back up to NVidia when it comes to Discrete GPU's in Laptop units. It's not a pretty sight, AMD is finally getting there, but they are getting there slowly.
I have provided Links below that will generally answer all the questions I have seen in this post. Like why doesn't it work the way I think it's supposed to work, or when it does work why are the frame rates so low. Why won't it use the AMD GPU instead of the Integrated Intel HD IGP, Please read the whole article as it sums up the technology nicely.
9/6/2012 article from AnandTech -
Introduction
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6243/amds-enduro-switchable-graphics-levels-up
Recap: AMD’s PowerXpress, aka Dynamic Switchable Graphics, aka Enduro
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6243/amds-enduro-switchable-graphics-levels-up/2
New for Mid-2012: “Enduro 5.5” Enhancements
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6243/amds-enduro-switchable-graphics-levels-up/3
Other Technical Details and Performance Expectations
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6243/amds-enduro-switchable-graphics-levels-up/4
Closing Thoughts
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6243/amds-enduro-switchable-graphics-levels-up/5
Cheers,
I hope the information that I provided helps everyone out.
EDIT:
Additional Informational Links in regards to AMD Discrete Cards plus a Windows 8 AMD Switchable Graphics FAQ
What's it all about - Here
HD 7000M Series Graphics - Here
Windows 8 with AMD Switchable Graphics FAQ - Here
CyberMaxX360
272 Posts
0
February 7th, 2013 16:00
Note to those complaining about their software NOT seeing the AMD GPU, it doesn't work that way. Again, please read up on the technology to have a better understanding, a lot has changed and if you haven't had a laptop with a Discrete GPU in it you are probably at a loss on how it truly works thus causing frustrations. This is not 2 years ago I can go into my bios and turn on or off one of the Video Cards technology of yesteryear.
These discrete cards use MUX-less technology, there are no physical switches between the video adapters and the display output ports - it's what Terry B was trying to point out. The Discrete GPU's still need the Integrated Graphics Processor (Intel HD) to actually display the video.
The old MUXed systems also allowed you to basically go into the BIOS and force the Active Display Adapter because each adapter was a full graphics card, that is to say the BIOS would force an internal physical electronic switch to drive the video output from the card you chose to the video output ports. As well you could have your software do the same, IE: Go into FS X and choose the Graphics Card - this would basically force the same internal electronic switch to send the video output from the card you chose to the video output port that the display was attached to.
Where as these new Discrete GPU's are all MUX-less, they do not have a display MUX(Switch) since the the video displays are only connected to the integrated cards display outputs. On MUX-less systems, the discrete card is solely for RENDERING, not display. Your Games will only see the Integrated Graphics Processor, it is clueless to what is RENDERING the actual graphics it has no idea that the IGP or the Discrete GPU rendered the frame.
Some of the newer applications, updates and patches are now being made aware to what the DRIVER has chosen and will display that as the graphics card being used. Take for instance a few of the benchmark tools out there. If you where to go into the Catalyst Driver (see below) and physically force the application to render on a specific graphics processor the benchmark tool will display it and report on it correctly. You see a lot of people not knowing how the technology works complaining that the benchmark is using the Intel HD card and displaying stats for the Intel HD when they expected it to use the Discrete GPU instead. They all complain that they can't go into the BIOS and deactivate the card, They all complain that the Discrete Card is not working probably, They all don't understand the technology that's what is obvious.
Change the Catalyst Driver (again see my note below) to force it to send rendering to the Discrete GPU when the Benchmark software runs solves the issue. It will internally report correctly and display stats for the correct card. Applications/Games will probably be following suit, that is if they claim they will work with these newer Discrete GPU's you usually get the disclaimer on a Game stating it only works with a certain line of GPU's most taking the standard line of not compatible with mobile graphic cards/drivers. But, 9 times out of 10 if you have a decent card it works, whether they put the code logic in to display what card is being used to render the output well that's a different story.
As Terry B stated, it's a shame that AMD's Enduro doesn't display some kind of information to when it is handling the rendering for an application.
The NVidia Optiums driver does for their line of discrete cards. I have a Dell 17R SE 7720 that uses an NVidia Discrete GPU, I'm able to force what application renders where, and I can see via the Optimus Driver when an application is using the Discrete Card for it's rendering. I'm not familiar with AMD, I am familiar with NVidia, but the technology is very similar so who knows perhaps AMD's 13.1 driver does this now.
So all in all... This is where it's important to have drivers that at least allow you to go into them and force applications to use the rendering engine on the GPU that you think can handle it better. Again, before the October BETA 12.11 Catalyst Drivers from AMD the driver did this at it's own discretion, if it failed to chose correctly you got stuck seeing graphics being rendered on the IGP instead. Their latest driver now offers this ability, not sure what Dell's version for your units are at, perhaps still below the OEMS reference 12.11 drivers.
Again I hope this helps those in this thread...
Cheers
DELL-Terry B
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3.5K Posts
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February 8th, 2013 11:00
CyberMaxX360
This is a great post and I appreciate you taking the time.
For the rest of you Inspiron 15r SE owners that are still having problems with your games please let me know. This is new technology and until better battery technology comes around I don't see Enduro or Optimus going away anytime soon. Hopefully AMD and Nvidia for that matter will create new drivers that make it easier to create profiles for games, and have clearer indicators on what GPUs are present and working on notebooks.
Hopefully new game and benchmark creators will create their new products to correctly show what GPU are currently rendering graphics.
TB
SkolKariol
11 Posts
0
February 9th, 2013 09:00
Any conclusion? Objective instructions? I am here with my Inspiron 15R SE with no functioning AMD 7730M. After all this, could you resume, what do I do? I am going to get my money back if that doesn't work.
CyberMaxX360
272 Posts
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February 9th, 2013 15:00
Conclusion - I have mine, AMD still playing catch-up to NVidia when it comes to Discrete cards and Drivers.
Objective instructions - Trying using the AMD Drivers direct from AMD's site.
If you read the blog posting by AMD you would notice that as of 12.11 Beta they changed the Catalyst Driver in regards to now allowing you to physically select when the Discrete Rendering Engine (that being your AMD 7730M) card should be used to offload rendering from the Integrated Graphics Processor (IGP) in this case the Intel HD4000. Prior to that it was Automatic (The catalyst driver determined when, if it felt the HD4000 can handle it so it was, at least now you can force it).
Please read the links I provided they are very detailed and explain it quite nicely. - I recommend that if you do go with AMD's own Driver that you run their verification tool as to it being a good idea to do a complete system backup as well, in case you have to revert your system back.
Current Version AMD Driver is 13.1 which added the Enduro UI interface for you to select applications that should be forced.
Cheers