I appreciate your candor about Dell's issues over Service & Support, while I'm personally biased towards Dell, I'll try to take an objective look at your situation.
Dell gives the option of using 1600x1200 UXGA+ resolution because there are some people out there (myself included) that can see that resolution just fine, and we appreciate the additional information we can display at such a massive resolution (like, 8 IM chat windows open side by side... ). Dell also gave the option, I believe, at the time of configuring the system with SXGA+ resolution (1400x1050). I personally think the 1600x1200 is best for the 15" LCDs, and 1400x1050 for the 14.1" ones, but anyways, and it doesn't take "super hero vision" to see something at 1600x1200. No offense intended, just trying to help.
With LCD technology, there are native resolutions screens are designed for. Anything else, lower resolutions, for example, because of the technology used, is bound to cause visual distortions because the monitor has to interpolate various pixels. Like calculate which ones should be turned on or off. SXGA res, 1280x1024, uses 1310720 pixels out of the available 1600x1200=1920000 pixels, which is what, like 68% of the screen. Also the SXGA resolution isn't really a "standard" resolution. Like it is, but it doesn't follow the 4:3 rule of all the resolutions. 1600x1200, 1400x1050, 1024x768, 800x600, 640x480, all 4x3 ratio. 1280x1024 is a 5:4 ratio, so it's kind of funky. So the screen, unless it's designed with that many pixels to begin with, and in that ratio, is gonna be a bit tempermental displaying anything less than what it's designed for, or at a resolution not at the 4:3 ratio.
So it's not really Dell's fault for implementing UXGA resolution. They just use whatever screens the manufacturers make, i.e. Hitachi, Samsung, etc. Yes, I agree with you that some Dell Tech Support reps are uhm, questionable, and so are the techs they send out, but hey, they gotta be somewhat familiar with all of Dell's systems, which could be almost a hundred, especially the phone support techs. I mean, for example, Dell's C-series laptops had what, at least 30 models over the years. They (the techs) probably only know the general support issues. It's probably not in the interest of "best business" to have a dedicated support staff for each individual model of laptop and desktop right? After all, some models might get more problems than others. Now I'm sorry you feel that way about Dell, but they're not really all THAT bad of a company. I mean, compare them to like, Compaq and HP or something... (A little humor there, us tech geeks think Compaq and HP computers are real P.O.S). I'm not going to ask you to change your views or anything, but before you totally slag Dell off your list, just consider your experience with ALL their systems that you own. I mean, if they were really that bad, you wouldn't own "a number of Dells", would you? I think that's why Dell's good, because their products are usually pretty reliable to begin with.
Anyways, back to your question. I have a 8100 model with a 15" UXGA configuration, so I'm kind of similar to what you have, so I jacked my resolution down to 1280x1024 like you did, and yes, the icons are a bit fuzzy, but not all that bad. Just to make sure of everything though, I assume you have loaded *all* of Windows 2000 updates loaded. Service Pack 4, and any other ones available. Also DirectX 9.0B, etc. Just so we can eliminate software issues.
In my experience, after having gone through... 1, 2, 3, 4, 5... Yeah, five laptops in my short life, the only time I came across fuzzy text and icons that were toooo fuzzy to be read was when I had a hardware issue with the laptop. Like the backlight component of the LCD panel start failing. If your system is still covered by the 3-year standard warranty, maybe call Dell up and have them send somebody out with a replacement LCD panel. It won't hurt if you're under warranty. Also, make sure you have the latest BIOS update as well. Like I said, just so we can eliminate all potential problems.
If I induced any offensive emotions, I apologize beforehand. Yes, I'm biased towards Dell, but hey, I'm just trying to help. No offense meant, and hope none taken.
(I haven't quite got the hang of this yet. My first reply to you seems to be lost in cyberspace.)
Thanks for your reply. Nothing offensive was written and no offense taken but it was kind of you to be concerned. In any case, I am thrilled to correspond with someone with more knowledge than the Dell technicians I have spoken to (and no offense to them intended!)
I like Dell too - we have four of them in the house including the one laptop. The laptop is a bit noisy but apart from the video issue, has been great. I meant that I would not buy another laptop from them if I had to choose between eyestrain from blurry print or eyestrain from too small (for me) print. My frustration lies in not being able to set it back up like it came out of the box - with clear text and icons - at a resolution that I can be comfortable with. I loved it for 2 1/2 years after all and have travelled over much of Europe with it. I now doubt myself over what resolution I was running it at before I had to reload Windows. However it certainly was not 1600 x 1200 and was something very close to 1280 x 1024. I know this because when I run my spreadsheets I knew exactly how big the window was before I had to scroll around.
I have tried the 1400x1050 and have the same blurriness. Also the display goes off the edges of the screen, if you know what I mean. I don't know how to adjust that on a laptop. Whenever I go into Display/Settings/Advanced and click on the Monitor tab the computer locks up and I have to restart. Mmmmm, suspicious???
Being an engineer, I appreciate the mathematical logic behind why the screen is blurry. I think that my problem is that there was a sudden deterioration between the original set up and what went back in when I reloaded W2k and all the drivers. It is as if there was another driver on the hard drive than was on the Dell discs that came with the machine. The one on the hard drive was ideal and the one reloaded back in from the disc was not. Downloading the latest driver did not help and yes, by the way, I am up to date on all the W2000 upgrades and DirectX 9.0b.
The screen does look good at 1600x1200 and seeing as the display change happened after the reload, I tend to doubt a hardware problem. I will keep in mind though what you wrote on a new LCD panel.
How do I obtain the latest BIOS updates? Perhaps that will help.
A word on the Techs. My corruption problem happened when I was downloading the latest W2k updates over an AOL dial up connection. I was told to restart to allow the updates to load and as I shut down AOL, it also downloaded its own updates. During the restart, the two updates seemed to quarrel with each other and leave me with a non-functioning Internet Explorer. I was thrown back and forth between Dell and AOL techs but eventually Dell saw me through. The AOL techs were all Indians in Bangalore and while they may be economical they have a long long long way to go. I once had an Indian Dell tech and was afraid to ask him if he was in Bangalore too. I hope Dell don't do that - at least not at the expense of laying off American workers with all that experience.
I have now just switched to Bellsouth DSL and it is the bees knees. Their tech help is how Dell and Gateway used to be six years ago - you can't say anything bad about them.
How do I obtain the latest BIOS updates? Perhaps that will help.
......
You can download the latest BIOS for Inspiron 8000 by clicking a tab called "Downloads" on the top.
However, I don't think that it will fix your problem. You see, every LCD is designed to work on a native resolution. In your case, the resolution would be 1600x1200. Although LCD also works on non-native resolutions, but the display quality might not be good. http://support.dell.com/us/en/kb/document.asp?DN=1060669
Just out of curiosity. Why did you buy a UXGA LCD when you can't stand the resolution? If you had chosen a lower resolution LCD, such as SXGA+, your eyes wouldn't hurt, and you even save some money.
Message Edited by liang_mike on 10-19-2003 03:43 PM
I think I am not making my point clearly. The display was fine, if not perfect, at the lower resolution. Since reloading Windows the quality has markedly gone down. Now it is very poor indeed.
Something is wrong and I don't know what. I am not skilled enough to fix it.
Another example: When I have Excel open the scroll bar on the left hand side has a horrible mottled look. Something is just not right.
I have been perfectly happy with it until now.
Why did I buy Dell? I had no idea what resolution meant when I bought it. I took it on trust that because it was a Dell, it would be good.
Well, nice to know I'm talking to an engineer too. That way, I can get all technical without having to use all laymen terms (aerospace rules! ).
Anyways, assuming (which us engineers hate to do) that it's not a hardware issue, and a software issue, AND the fact that you have system lockups when you try and access display settings, I personally think your description of a conflict with AOL updates and Windows Updates may have messed something up. Personally, I'd format and reinstall as a first step (yes, I know, it's a pain, many thanks to Microsoft), but with your new broadband ISP, you shouldn't have anymore "conflicting updates".
Also, I think the problem may lie in the combination of your video card BIOS (not system BIOS, video card BIOS) and your display driver. I remember a time when Dell released a new video card driver that required a new video BIOS as well. Because you're using the newest M4 drivers, and the original M4 BIOS, the BIOS may not be uhm, current, enough to work well with the latest drivers. I think you should go look for the latest FlashBIOS for the ATI M4 video card.
Basically it's a tricky combination. You gotta have the right Video BIOS, coupled with the right Windows Display Driver, in order to get that "best" combination. Dell should list FlashBIOS updates for the video cards as well, located in the same place they list their video driver updates. If not, well, do a search. As a last resort, call up Dell Tech Support.and ask them for it.
Or else you could go backwards and find the *right* version of the driver that works with your current video bios, which would be a real pain, and entail a whole hecuvalot of reboots. Last I checked, for the I8000 system, the video drivers is up to version A10. 10 downloads, 10 reboots, and find the right combination. Not exactly the most efficient process, but it might get you what you want.
But, like I said above, I think your first step should be to reformat and fix whatever issues are causing the video settings to lock up.
********************************************* Genyosha B.S. Aerospace & Mechanical Eng. CompTIA A+ Certified IT Professional CompTIA Network+ Certified Professional http://www.comptia.org *********************************************
I think you are on the right track with your suggestions. I have just tried to download earlier versions of the driver (there were four or five) but they were not available. I am supposed to try back later. I noticed in the Device Manager that the driver(?) had installed four monitors, including one default monitor. Crazy.
Anyway, I am going to be out of town for a few days and will have to try when I come back.
Is there any way that the original versions of whatever was loaded at the factory can be traced?
In my Inspiron 8100, I have three displays listed in WinXP device manager. In my Latitude C510, I have four. I remember also having four displays listed in the device manager in Win2000 with my old Inspiron 5000. If I were to guess, I'd guess that the reason there are so many devices listed in the monitors subsection of device manager is to allow easy hot swapping of display devices. That is, if you were going into a presentation, you could plug in your external projector / TV / Plasma / Widescreen and press a FN combination key and quickly get external display, instead of having to go into display properties, advanced settings, etc and redetect the displays.
If I were to try and trace which versions were loaded onto your system during ship, I would locate your system's ship date, which you can get with the Service Tag in the Support Site, and find the driver that was released at the latest time, relative to your ship date. I still think the ones on the CD would be the same ones, but eh, who knows. Just try everything. :-P
The displays listed represent the various types of displays supported by the video card, the built-in LCD, a VGA port monitor, an s-video port TV, and in those that have four, DVI. These are in the driver, and may not represent what is available to you, depending on your hardware.
I have returned from my overseas trip. I had a good think while I was away and decided just to live with the1600 x 1200 resolution. I wasted a great deal of time just resolving the corruption problem and I really don't wish to spend any more time trying to put the display back where it was.
I really do thank you for your inputs, especially Mr (Ms?) Genyosha. This person was the only one who seemed to really appreciate the problem and offer great advice.
I am sure that I will get used to the small print - perhaps I just need glasses! I have certainly gained some useful knowledge about LCD screen if nothing else.
Genyosha
30 Posts
0
October 19th, 2003 07:00
I appreciate your candor about Dell's issues over Service & Support, while I'm personally biased towards Dell, I'll try to take an objective look at your situation.
Dell gives the option of using 1600x1200 UXGA+ resolution because there are some people out there (myself included) that can see that resolution just fine, and we appreciate the additional information we can display at such a massive resolution (like, 8 IM chat windows open side by side...
). Dell also gave the option, I believe, at the time of configuring the system with SXGA+ resolution (1400x1050). I personally think the 1600x1200 is best for the 15" LCDs, and 1400x1050 for the 14.1" ones, but anyways, and it doesn't take "super hero vision" to see something at 1600x1200. No offense intended, just trying to help.
With LCD technology, there are native resolutions screens are designed for. Anything else, lower resolutions, for example, because of the technology used, is bound to cause visual distortions because the monitor has to interpolate various pixels. Like calculate which ones should be turned on or off. SXGA res, 1280x1024, uses 1310720 pixels out of the available 1600x1200=1920000 pixels, which is what, like 68% of the screen. Also the SXGA resolution isn't really a "standard" resolution. Like it is, but it doesn't follow the 4:3 rule of all the resolutions. 1600x1200, 1400x1050, 1024x768, 800x600, 640x480, all 4x3 ratio. 1280x1024 is a 5:4 ratio, so it's kind of funky. So the screen, unless it's designed with that many pixels to begin with, and in that ratio, is gonna be a bit tempermental displaying anything less than what it's designed for, or at a resolution not at the 4:3 ratio.
So it's not really Dell's fault for implementing UXGA resolution. They just use whatever screens the manufacturers make, i.e. Hitachi, Samsung, etc. Yes, I agree with you that some Dell Tech Support reps are uhm, questionable, and so are the techs they send out, but hey, they gotta be somewhat familiar with all of Dell's systems, which could be almost a hundred, especially the phone support techs. I mean, for example, Dell's C-series laptops had what, at least 30 models over the years. They (the techs) probably only know the general support issues. It's probably not in the interest of "best business" to have a dedicated support staff for each individual model of laptop and desktop right? After all, some models might get more problems than others. Now I'm sorry you feel that way about Dell, but they're not really all THAT bad of a company. I mean, compare them to like, Compaq and HP or something... (A little humor there, us tech geeks think Compaq and HP computers are real P.O.S). I'm not going to ask you to change your views or anything, but before you totally slag Dell off your list, just consider your experience with ALL their systems that you own. I mean, if they were really that bad, you wouldn't own "a number of Dells", would you? I think that's why Dell's good, because their products are usually pretty reliable to begin with.
Anyways, back to your question. I have a 8100 model with a 15" UXGA configuration, so I'm kind of similar to what you have, so I jacked my resolution down to 1280x1024 like you did, and yes, the icons are a bit fuzzy, but not all that bad. Just to make sure of everything though, I assume you have loaded *all* of Windows 2000 updates loaded. Service Pack 4, and any other ones available. Also DirectX 9.0B, etc. Just so we can eliminate software issues.
In my experience, after having gone through... 1, 2, 3, 4, 5... Yeah, five laptops in my short life, the only time I came across fuzzy text and icons that were toooo fuzzy to be read was when I had a hardware issue with the laptop. Like the backlight component of the LCD panel start failing. If your system is still covered by the 3-year standard warranty, maybe call Dell up and have them send somebody out with a replacement LCD panel. It won't hurt if you're under warranty. Also, make sure you have the latest BIOS update as well. Like I said, just so we can eliminate all potential problems.
If I induced any offensive emotions, I apologize beforehand. Yes, I'm biased towards Dell, but hey, I'm just trying to help. No offense meant, and hope none taken.
Yarmbutts
5 Posts
0
October 19th, 2003 19:00
Dear Genyosha,
(I haven't quite got the hang of this yet. My first reply to you seems to be lost in cyberspace.)
Thanks for your reply. Nothing offensive was written and no offense taken but it was kind of you to be concerned. In any case, I am thrilled to correspond with someone with more knowledge than the Dell technicians I have spoken to (and no offense to them intended!)
I like Dell too - we have four of them in the house including the one laptop. The laptop is a bit noisy but apart from the video issue, has been great. I meant that I would not buy another laptop from them if I had to choose between eyestrain from blurry print or eyestrain from too small (for me) print. My frustration lies in not being able to set it back up like it came out of the box - with clear text and icons - at a resolution that I can be comfortable with. I loved it for 2 1/2 years after all and have travelled over much of Europe with it. I now doubt myself over what resolution I was running it at before I had to reload Windows. However it certainly was not 1600 x 1200 and was something very close to 1280 x 1024. I know this because when I run my spreadsheets I knew exactly how big the window was before I had to scroll around.
I have tried the 1400x1050 and have the same blurriness. Also the display goes off the edges of the screen, if you know what I mean. I don't know how to adjust that on a laptop. Whenever I go into Display/Settings/Advanced and click on the Monitor tab the computer locks up and I have to restart. Mmmmm, suspicious???
Being an engineer, I appreciate the mathematical logic behind why the screen is blurry. I think that my problem is that there was a sudden deterioration between the original set up and what went back in when I reloaded W2k and all the drivers. It is as if there was another driver on the hard drive than was on the Dell discs that came with the machine. The one on the hard drive was ideal and the one reloaded back in from the disc was not. Downloading the latest driver did not help and yes, by the way, I am up to date on all the W2000 upgrades and DirectX 9.0b.
The screen does look good at 1600x1200 and seeing as the display change happened after the reload, I tend to doubt a hardware problem. I will keep in mind though what you wrote on a new LCD panel.
How do I obtain the latest BIOS updates? Perhaps that will help.
A word on the Techs. My corruption problem happened when I was downloading the latest W2k updates over an AOL dial up connection. I was told to restart to allow the updates to load and as I shut down AOL, it also downloaded its own updates. During the restart, the two updates seemed to quarrel with each other and leave me with a non-functioning Internet Explorer. I was thrown back and forth between Dell and AOL techs but eventually Dell saw me through. The AOL techs were all Indians in Bangalore and while they may be economical they have a long long long way to go. I once had an Indian Dell tech and was afraid to ask him if he was in Bangalore too. I hope Dell don't do that - at least not at the expense of laying off American workers with all that experience.
I have now just switched to Bellsouth DSL and it is the bees knees. Their tech help is how Dell and Gateway used to be six years ago - you can't say anything bad about them.
Again, many thanks for your interest.
liang_mike
19 Posts
0
October 19th, 2003 21:00
You can download the latest BIOS for Inspiron 8000 by clicking a tab called "Downloads" on the top.
However, I don't think that it will fix your problem. You see, every LCD is designed to work on a native resolution. In your case, the resolution would be 1600x1200. Although LCD also works on non-native resolutions, but the display quality might not be good. http://support.dell.com/us/en/kb/document.asp?DN=1060669
Just out of curiosity. Why did you buy a UXGA LCD when you can't stand the resolution? If you had chosen a lower resolution LCD, such as SXGA+, your eyes wouldn't hurt, and you even save some money.
Message Edited by liang_mike on 10-19-2003 03:43 PM
Yarmbutts
5 Posts
0
October 19th, 2003 23:00
I think I am not making my point clearly. The display was fine, if not perfect, at the lower resolution. Since reloading Windows the quality has markedly gone down. Now it is very poor indeed.
Something is wrong and I don't know what. I am not skilled enough to fix it.
Another example: When I have Excel open the scroll bar on the left hand side has a horrible mottled look. Something is just not right.
I have been perfectly happy with it until now.
Why did I buy Dell? I had no idea what resolution meant when I bought it. I took it on trust that because it was a Dell, it would be good.
And it was, until now!
Thanks though, for your help.
Genyosha
30 Posts
0
October 20th, 2003 03:00
Well, nice to know I'm talking to an engineer too. That way, I can get all technical without having to use all laymen terms (aerospace rules!
).
Anyways, assuming (which us engineers hate to do) that it's not a hardware issue, and a software issue, AND the fact that you have system lockups when you try and access display settings, I personally think your description of a conflict with AOL updates and Windows Updates may have messed something up. Personally, I'd format and reinstall as a first step (yes, I know, it's a pain, many thanks to Microsoft), but with your new broadband ISP, you shouldn't have anymore "conflicting updates".
Also, I think the problem may lie in the combination of your video card BIOS (not system BIOS, video card BIOS) and your display driver. I remember a time when Dell released a new video card driver that required a new video BIOS as well. Because you're using the newest M4 drivers, and the original M4 BIOS, the BIOS may not be uhm, current, enough to work well with the latest drivers. I think you should go look for the latest FlashBIOS for the ATI M4 video card.
Basically it's a tricky combination. You gotta have the right Video BIOS, coupled with the right Windows Display Driver, in order to get that "best" combination. Dell should list FlashBIOS updates for the video cards as well, located in the same place they list their video driver updates. If not, well, do a search. As a last resort, call up Dell Tech Support.and ask them for it.
Or else you could go backwards and find the *right* version of the driver that works with your current video bios, which would be a real pain, and entail a whole hecuvalot of reboots. Last I checked, for the I8000 system, the video drivers is up to version A10. 10 downloads, 10 reboots, and find the right combination. Not exactly the most efficient process, but it might get you what you want.
But, like I said above, I think your first step should be to reformat and fix whatever issues are causing the video settings to lock up.
*********************************************
Genyosha
B.S. Aerospace & Mechanical Eng.
CompTIA A+ Certified IT Professional
CompTIA Network+ Certified Professional
http://www.comptia.org
*********************************************
Yarmbutts
5 Posts
0
October 20th, 2003 22:00
I think you are on the right track with your suggestions. I have just tried to download earlier versions of the driver (there were four or five) but they were not available. I am supposed to try back later. I noticed in the Device Manager that the driver(?) had installed four monitors, including one default monitor. Crazy.
Anyway, I am going to be out of town for a few days and will have to try when I come back.
Is there any way that the original versions of whatever was loaded at the factory can be traced?
Thanks, from a chemical engineer.
Genyosha
30 Posts
0
October 21st, 2003 04:00
In my Inspiron 8100, I have three displays listed in WinXP device manager. In my Latitude C510, I have four. I remember also having four displays listed in the device manager in Win2000 with my old Inspiron 5000. If I were to guess, I'd guess that the reason there are so many devices listed in the monitors subsection of device manager is to allow easy hot swapping of display devices. That is, if you were going into a presentation, you could plug in your external projector / TV / Plasma / Widescreen and press a FN combination key and quickly get external display, instead of having to go into display properties, advanced settings, etc and redetect the displays.
If I were to try and trace which versions were loaded onto your system during ship, I would locate your system's ship date, which you can get with the Service Tag in the Support Site, and find the driver that was released at the latest time, relative to your ship date. I still think the ones on the CD would be the same ones, but eh, who knows. Just try everything. :-P
Rollie_R
2 Intern
•
2.2K Posts
0
October 21st, 2003 20:00
All,
The displays listed represent the various types of displays supported by the video card, the built-in LCD, a VGA port monitor, an s-video port TV, and in those that have four, DVI. These are in the driver, and may not represent what is available to you, depending on your hardware.
Yarmbutts
5 Posts
0
November 7th, 2003 00:00
Dear All,
I have returned from my overseas trip. I had a good think while I was away and decided just to live with the1600 x 1200 resolution. I wasted a great deal of time just resolving the corruption problem and I really don't wish to spend any more time trying to put the display back where it was.
I really do thank you for your inputs, especially Mr (Ms?) Genyosha. This person was the only one who seemed to really appreciate the problem and offer great advice.
I am sure that I will get used to the small print - perhaps I just need glasses! I have certainly gained some useful knowledge about LCD screen if nothing else.