Unsolved
6 Posts
22
32470
U3818DW, USB Type-C power delivery problem
(1) I have collected the Service Tag and S/N
(2) Hard reset does not affect the behavior
(3) Factory reset does not affect the behavior. There is no issue with image quality.
(4) Post your issue in public and all of the following data
* The issue and all of the troubleshooting you have performed
My Dell U3818DW consistently wakes my laptop up shortly after the laptop goes to sleep when powering it via USB Type-C from the U3818DW, causing infinite sleep/wake loops and preventing the laptop from ever actually sleeping. The laptop sleeps fine when powered by the USB Type-C power supply it came with.
I investigated using a professional USB Type-C protocol analyzer and found the difference: My Dell U3818DW violates USB Type-C power delivery protocol when the laptop goes to sleep (by not sending the required PS_RDY message after accepting a request, details below), causing the laptop to wake back up.
The "Product Features" section of the Dell U3818DW User's Guide says it "Supports USB Type-C" but the USB Type-C support has a defect. Can you please provide an updated U3818DW firmware that fixes this defect?
Equipment used:
Dell U3818DW monitor running latest firmware M3B106
Dell USB Type-C cable (6ft) supplied with U3818DW monitor
Anker Powerline II USB-C to USB-C 3.1 Gen 2 Cable (3ft) with Power Delivery
PC Laptop running Windows 10
USB Type-C power supply included with laptop
Total Phase USB-C PD analyzer running FW 1.11 and Total Phase Data Center 6.73.007 (https://www.totalphase.com/products/usb-power-delivery-analyzer/)
Test setup:
The U3818DW has two cables connected: wall power and the USB Type-C cable to the laptop.
The laptop has one cable connected: the USB Type-C cable to the monitor.
There are no other connections to any port on the laptop or the monitor.
I read the "USB Type-C monitors FAQ" post that says "5GHz, Gen 1, 1.8m/5.9ft, DP Alt Mode USB Type-C to C cable", "JNC22 = U3419W/U3818DW", "If your USB Type-C monitor shipped with the longer USB Type-C to C cable, you cannot use the monitor to charge the laptop" so I tried the 3ft Anker cable as well as the Dell supplied 6ft cable. The behavior is identical for both USB Type-C cables.
The behavior is identical with or without the USB Type-C analyzer connected. I originally observed this behavior without any analyzer and the behavior is unchanged with the analyzer connected.
Test steps:
1) Start with laptop awake and with a 100% full battery, USB Type-C cable not connected to the laptop.
2) Connect the USB Type-C cable to the power source: either the monitor or laptop power supply.
3) Connect the USB Type-C PD analyzer to the far end of the USB Type-C cable away from the power source, i.e. analyzer->USB Type-C cable->(monitor or laptop power supply)
3) Start the trace in Total Phase Data Center
4) Connect the analyzer to the USB Type-C port on the laptop, i.e. laptop USB Type-C port->analyzer->USB Type-C cable->(monitor or laptop power supply)
5) Wait for the USB Type-C PD handshake to finish and the laptop to indicate it's powered (at 20V, 4.3 or 4.4A)
6) Tell the laptop to go to sleep
This is where the behavior varies depending on which USB Type-C power source is used:
If using the laptop power supply, the behavior is as expected. The laptop goes to sleep and the final USB Type-C PD activity is a request 5V 2.4A from the sink (laptop) -> accept from the source (monitor) -> PS_RDY from the source, then no more traffic. You can see the details in the Laptop power supply trace below.
If using the monitor, the laptop and monitor wake back up every ~1 minute forever. The trace shows a loop where each iteration of the loop has:
- ~1 minute of no traffic
- USB Type-C PD request 5V 3A from the sink, accept form the source, but no PS_RDY from the source (this violates USB Type-C spec, details below)
- USB Type-C PD hard reset
The loop repeats indefinitely. You can see the details in the U3818DW trace below.
The U3818DW trace shows the U3818DW is violating USB Type-C spec by not sending a PS_RDY within the allowed time after the laptop sends a 5V 3A request and the U3818DW sends an accept. Instead, the link is hard reset.
In USB-PD R2.0 v1.3 spec, Figure 7-18 and Table 17-10 show how a decrease in voltage and current must occur after the source accepts the sink's request. A PS_RDY is expected from the source within PSTransitionTimer / tPSTransition timer (min 450ms from request.) In the U3818DW trace, there is no PS_RDY from the monitor after it sends accept in response to the sink's request. The link is hard reset 121.3ms after the monitor sends accept.
The Laptop power supply trace shows how it's supposed to work:
# Laptop waits ~1 minute, then sends 2.4A max current request
0,v2.0,1465,0:47.708.180,629.000 us,10 B,,1,Sink:UFP,[7]Request,42 1E F0 C0 03 13 DD B1 D8 94
# Power supply acknowledges the request from laptop
0,,1469,0:47.708.821,489.000 us,6 B,,1,Source:DFP,[7]GoodCRC,61 0F 88 55 80 AD
# Power supply accepts laptop request
0,v2.0,1472,0:47.709.751,492.000 us,6 B,,1,Source:DFP,[3]Accept,63 07 38 BF 6D 91
# Laptop acks accept from power supply
0,,1475,0:47.710.297,493.000 us,6 B,,1,Sink:UFP,[3]GoodCRC,41 06 8E C9 D8 41
# Power supply sends PS_RDY
0,v2.0,1478,0:47.975.745,492.000 us,6 B,,1,Source:DFP,[4]PS_RDY,66 09 7A 66 A2 0B
# Laptop acks PS_RDY from power supply
0,,1481,0:47.976.213,497.000 us,6 B,,1,Sink:UFP,[4]GoodCRC,41 08 89 E4 60 A6
# The laptop goes to sleep and stays asleep.
The Dell U3818DW trace shows how the monitor violates USB Type-C PD protocol and causes a infinite sleep/wake loop:
# Laptop waits ~1 minute, then sends a 3A max current request
0,v2.0,635,2:00.591.836,625.000 us,10 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[2]Request,62 14 2C B1 04 13 CB 3E 34 AF
# Monitor acks the request from laptop
0,,639,2:00.592.359,495.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[2]GoodCRC,41 05 34 98 D1 D8
# Monitor Accepts laptop request
0,v2.0,642,2:00.593.160,491.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[5]Accept,43 0B B1 D7 5F 0D
# Laptop acks accept from monitor
0,,645,2:00.593.693,496.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[5]GoodCRC,61 0A 07 A1 EA DD
# The link is hard reset before PSTransitionTimer/tPSTransition timer expires (min 450ms from request)
0,,648,2:00.714.550,276.000 us,0 B,,2,,Hard Reset,
# This block shows the laptop and monitor starting the USB-C link all over again after the hard reset
0,v2.0,680,2:03.100.661,623.000 us,10 B,,2,DFP/UFP,[0]VDM:DiscIdentity,4F 10 01 80 00 FF F0 1D A7 5B
0,,684,2:03.101.287,500.000 us,6 B,,2,Cable,[0]GoodCRC,41 01 2D 5C BC DF
0,v2.0,687,2:03.102.852,1.167.000 ms,26 B,,2,Cable,[0]VDM:DiscIdentity,4F 51 41 80 00 FF C4 06 00 18 8F 00 00 00 52 32 80 C1 51 40 08 23 F9 AE A6 BF
0,,695,2:03.104.025,495.000 us,6 B,,2,DFP/UFP,[0]GoodCRC,41 00 BB 6C BB A8
0,v2.0,698,2:03.105.323,1.023.000 ms,22 B,,2,Source:DFP,[0]Source_Cap,61 41 2C 91 01 0C 2C D1 02 00 2C B1 04 00 F4 41 16 00 9B 88 45 B1
0,,705,2:03.106.458,496.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:UFP,[0]GoodCRC,41 00 BB 6C BB A8
0,v2.0,708,2:03.120.315,625.000 us,10 B,,2,Sink:UFP,[0]Request,42 10 B8 E1 06 43 08 F6 DB 5A
0,,712,2:03.121.046,495.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:DFP,[0]GoodCRC,61 01 8F 78 38 4A
0,v2.0,715,2:03.121.631,495.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:DFP,[1]Accept,63 03 21 7B 00 96
0,,718,2:03.122.341,496.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:UFP,[1]GoodCRC,41 02 97 0D B5 46
0,v2.0,721,2:03.157.619,495.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:DFP,[2]PS_RDY,66 05 51 2A 14 02
0,,724,2:03.158.221,493.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:UFP,[2]GoodCRC,41 04 A2 A8 D6 AF
0,v2.0,727,2:03.159.492,491.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:DFP,[3]DR_Swap,69 07 B2 57 82 6B
0,,730,2:03.160.202,492.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:UFP,[3]GoodCRC,41 06 8E C9 D8 41
0,v2.0,733,2:03.164.098,493.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:UFP,[1]Accept,43 02 15 6F 83 74
0,,736,2:03.164.809,491.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:DFP,[1]GoodCRC,61 03 A3 19 36 A4
0,v2.0,739,2:03.270.866,629.000 us,10 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[2]VDM:DiscIdentity,6F 14 01 80 00 FF 06 BE 8B A9
0,,743,2:03.271.390,495.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[2]GoodCRC,41 05 34 98 D1 D8
0,v2.0,746,2:03.272.209,1.023.000 ms,22 B,,2,Source:UFP,[4]VDM:DiscIdentity,4F 49 41 80 00 FF 3C 41 00 C4 51 04 00 00 10 00 5F B0 37 7C 30 CC
0,,754,2:03.273.559,494.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[4]GoodCRC,61 08 2B C0 E4 33
0,v2.0,757,2:03.277.347,625.000 us,10 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[3]VDM:DiscSVID,6F 16 02 80 00 FF 88 42 FE C1
0,,761,2:03.278.084,494.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[3]GoodCRC,41 07 18 F9 DF 36
0,v2.0,764,2:03.278.810,759.000 us,14 B,,2,Source:UFP,[5]VDM:DiscSVID,4F 2B 42 80 00 FF 00 00 01 FF 07 1E 4C 91
0,,769,2:03.279.674,496.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[5]GoodCRC,61 0A 07 A1 EA DD
0,v2.0,772,2:03.283.574,629.000 us,10 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[4]VDM:DiscMode,6F 18 03 80 01 FF CD AA 69 DF
0,,776,2:03.284.415,491.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[4]GoodCRC,41 09 1F D4 67 D1
0,v2.0,779,2:03.285.139,759.000 us,14 B,,2,Source:UFP,[6]VDM:DiscMode,4F 2D 43 80 01 FF 45 00 1C 00 28 9F 04 9B
0,,784,2:03.285.961,496.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[6]GoodCRC,61 0C 32 04 89 34
0,v2.0,787,2:03.290.009,493.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[5]VCONN_Swap,6B 0A 8D 49 05 27
0,,790,2:03.290.719,491.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[5]GoodCRC,41 0B 33 B5 69 3F
0,v2.0,793,2:03.291.170,495.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[7]Accept,43 0F A8 13 32 0A
0,,796,2:03.291.880,492.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[7]GoodCRC,61 0E 1E 65 87 DA
0,v2.0,799,2:03.295.895,492.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[6]PS_RDY,66 0C F5 92 C8 7B
0,,802,2:03.296.502,495.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[6]GoodCRC,41 0D 06 10 0A D6
0,v2.0,806,2:03.343.496,493.000 us,6 B,,2,DFP/UFP,[0]Soft_Reset,4D 00 B7 23 0E 04
0,,809,2:03.344.203,500.000 us,6 B,,2,Cable,[0]GoodCRC,41 01 2D 5C BC DF
0,v2.0,812,2:03.345.555,496.000 us,6 B,,2,Cable,[0]Accept,43 01 AF 3E 8A ED
0,,815,2:03.346.161,496.000 us,6 B,,2,DFP/UFP,[0]GoodCRC,41 00 BB 6C BB A8
0,v2.0,818,2:03.347.451,628.000 us,10 B,,2,DFP/UFP,[1]VDM:DiscIdentity,4F 12 01 80 00 FF 90 4E 67 21
0,,822,2:03.347.976,500.000 us,6 B,,2,Cable,[1]GoodCRC,41 03 01 3D B2 31
0,v2.0,825,2:03.349.540,1.164.000 ms,26 B,,2,Cable,[1]VDM:DiscIdentity,4F 53 41 80 00 FF C4 06 00 18 8F 00 00 00 52 32 80 C1 51 40 08 23 84 AF 62 5B
0,,833,2:03.350.811,496.000 us,6 B,,2,DFP/UFP,[1]GoodCRC,41 02 97 0D B5 46
0,v2.0,836,2:03.352.495,625.000 us,10 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[7]VDM:EnterMode,6F 1E 04 81 01 FF E3 0D 3C CC
0,,840,2:03.353.230,491.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[7]GoodCRC,41 0F 2A 71 04 38
0,v2.0,843,2:03.354.010,627.000 us,10 B,,2,Source:UFP,[0]VDM:EnterMode,4F 11 44 81 01 FF 39 C7 D4 D2
0,,847,2:03.354.752,493.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[0]GoodCRC,61 00 19 48 3F 3D
0,v2.0,850,2:03.358.760,761.000 us,14 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[0]VDM:DPStatus,6F 20 10 81 01 FF 01 00 00 00 09 16 C9 AA
0,,855,2:03.359.626,495.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[0]GoodCRC,41 01 2D 5C BC DF
0,v2.0,858,2:03.360.371,756.000 us,14 B,,2,Source:UFP,[1]VDM:DPStatus,4F 23 50 81 01 FF 0A 00 00 00 F0 6C 85 22
0,,863,2:03.361.344,493.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[1]GoodCRC,61 02 35 29 31 D3
0,v2.0,866,2:03.365.245,758.000 us,14 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[1]VDM:DPConfigure,6F 22 11 81 01 FF 06 04 00 00 74 AE 4B D2
0,,871,2:03.366.004,495.000 us,6 B,,2,Source:UFP,[1]GoodCRC,41 03 01 3D B2 31
0,v2.0,874,2:03.367.024,627.000 us,10 B,,2,Source:UFP,[2]VDM:DPConfigure,4F 15 51 81 01 FF 54 C6 93 40
0,,878,2:03.367.666,496.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[2]GoodCRC,61 04 00 8C 52 3A
0,v2.0,882,2:04.363.087,755.000 us,14 B,,2,Source:UFP,[3]VDM:Attention,4F 27 06 81 01 FF 8A 00 00 00 86 71 79 01
0,,887,2:04.363.721,492.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[3]GoodCRC,61 06 2C ED 5C D4
0,v2.0,890,2:05.650.323,759.000 us,14 B,,2,Source:UFP,[4]VDM:Attention,4F 29 06 81 01 FF 8A 01 00 00 23 C0 79 C8
0,,895,2:05.651.086,496.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[4]GoodCRC,61 08 2B C0 E4 33
0,v2.0,898,2:09.150.899,759.000 us,14 B,,2,Source:UFP,[5]VDM:Attention,4F 2B 06 81 01 FF 8A 01 00 00 A5 E8 8F E6
0,,903,2:09.151.872,496.000 us,6 B,,2,Sink:DFP,[5]GoodCRC,61 0A 07 A1 EA DD
# The laptop waits ~1 minute, then the request->accept->NO PS_RDY defect->hard reset occurs again, then the link starts over again, etc.
# The loop repeats forever.
3818owner
6 Posts
4
January 25th, 2020 08:00
Page 29 of the Dell UltraSharp U3818DW Monitor User’s Guide says "The USB Type-C power delivery compliant port (PD Version 2.0) delivers up to 100 W of power."
Based on this statement, I purchased a U3818DW monitor to use with my USB-C PD 2.0 compliant laptop. The monitor is not functioning correctly and I have demonstrated in detail how the monitor is not USB-C PD 2.0 complaint and has a defect in its USB-C PD implementation.
Will Dell resolve this defect with a firmware update?
JimDev88
1 Message
1
January 26th, 2020 15:00
OP says:
"My Dell U3818DW consistently wakes my laptop up shortly after the laptop goes to sleep when powering it via USB Type-C from the U3818DW, causing infinite sleep/wake loops and preventing the laptop from ever actually sleeping. The laptop sleeps fine when powered by the USB Type-C power supply it came with."
Since you have a Windows laptop, and this is exactly the same issue and symptoms all the Macbook Pro users with U3419W monitors (34" curved") are complaining about, I see it's not just an Apple problem:
Dell U3419W connected via USB C keeps scanning for signal when MacBook is sleeping
U3419W, MacBook, USB Type-C, sleep/wake issues
OP, thank you for tracking down the real cause!!!
As a workaround until this gets fixed, is there a way to completely shut off the monitor charging output via USB-C?
Dell needs to fix this since this monitor claims to support USB-C charging.
nickpicker
6 Posts
2
February 8th, 2020 11:00
That's not the only bug in their firmware as of now (M3B106). Four other bugs present:
* When connected over DisplayPort, and when keyboard and/or mouse are connected to the builtin hub of the U3818DW, the Windows computer can't be woken up through the keyboard or mouse. Waking up with keyboard/mouse with the same setup works when connecting the U3818DW over USB-C.
* NightShift is not supported on the U3818DW, neither over USB-C nor DisplayPort. The much older U3415W supports NightShift just fine on the exact same machine with the same version of Mac OS.
* In the menu there's only 21:9, AutoResize, 4:3, 1:1, but not 16:10 or 16:9 mode. This is clearly a bug as other 21:9 displays from Dell support 16:9/10.
* When connecting two machines to the display and using the internal hub of the U3818DW to share keyboard and mouse, and when switching to an input source on the display where the current setting is not assigning the currently used internal USB connection (USB 1 or USB 2), it's not possible to enter the display's menu to change the USB 1/2 assignment unless there's a signal. This makes it impossible to change the USB assignment in cases where one machine is still in sleep mode.
I'm very puzzled why Dell released with display with so many issues. Looking back at my history with Dell displays, going as far back as the 2405, this U3818DW shows a terrible lack of quality control.
(edited)
mpereira1
14 Posts
2
February 10th, 2020 01:00
I wish Dell would listen to its customers and start working towards making sure that at least these high-end monitors work with Macbooks given how many Macbook owners are buying it.
mpereira1
14 Posts
0
February 10th, 2020 01:00
This great and detailed bug report was created a month ago, could we please hear from someone from Dell if it's at least planned that this issue will be fixed?
mpereira1
14 Posts
3
February 11th, 2020 02:00
I see the exact same behavior on my Macbook Pro. After telling the Macbook to sleep, the monitor will take it up every 60 seconds.
The Macbook is connected to the monitor using the USB-C cable provided by Dell.
Every 60 seconds this message shows up in the logs, and the Macbook wakes from sleep:
Wake from Normal Sleep [CDNVA] due to EC.DarkPME XHC1/Notification: Using AC (Charge:100%) WakeDetails DriverReason:XHC1
DELL-Chris M
Community Manager
Community Manager
•
55K Posts
0
February 11th, 2020 04:00
On 1/13, I forwarded the link to this thread to them via email. User 3818owner stated, "PC Laptop running Windows 10". I was told to ask him via Private Message what specific Laptop model. We have yet to receive a response.
Aglow
1 Message
0
February 13th, 2020 08:00
I am having the exact same issue on both my machines with a newly purchased Dell 3818. The ping pong sleep wake beep issue. You are asking for model numbers?
Mid-2018 MacBook Pro 15" and 2019 MacBook Pro 15"
I am about to return this monitor and get another brand if there is no news on incoming firmware fixes.
Thanks!
(edited)
nickpicker
6 Posts
0
February 13th, 2020 11:00
Dell is in fact advertising the display as supporting USB-C Power Delivery, and as the OP has proven the display has a faulty implementation of USB-C PD by not adhering to the standardized USB-C PD protocol. In that regard it does not matter if the display is connected to a Windows machine or a Mac. Incidentally, the tests that OP has done were on a Windows machine, and the only reason why there's no larger public outcry over this issue is because so few Windows laptops actually support USB-C PD. Please name a single Dell laptop that supports USB-C Power Delivery and, when connected to the U3818DW, where sleep works correctly. Surely Dell must have tested the display with such a machine when Dell's representative in this forum is so confident that the issue is not present on Windows machines, right? Once you have provided me with the model number of this Dell laptop I'll buy it and prove beyond doubt that the exact same issue persists with the Dell laptop running Windows. That is, assuming that you'll ever be able to name such a machine.
(edited)
ethernity
2 Posts
0
February 13th, 2020 16:00
We are experiencing the same issues as above with Macbook Pros and the U3419W.
hansdereber
1 Message
0
February 23rd, 2020 04:00
I have the same problem with the USB-C charging as the OP. I also expect a premium USB-C product to be compliant with the USB-C spec. I like the monitor and would love to receive a patched version of the firmware that fixes the USB-C charging.
(edited)
DELL-Chris M
Community Manager
Community Manager
•
55K Posts
0
February 25th, 2020 06:00
All read the Forum Code of Conduct which you agreed to when joining this Dell Forum.
With the release of Apple OS Mojave 10.14.3, Apple introduced a hardware incompatibility issue with our TPS6598E power delivery controller in the U3419W and U3818DW. When connected to the U3419W and U3818DW via the USB-C cable, if you update the macOS to Mojave 10.14.3 or later, you will see the following issues =
* Fully charged Apple MacBook constant "charm" sound due to waking and sleeping
* The monitor will display, "Scanning for Signal"
There will not be a monitor hardware power delivery controller upgrade to correct this hardware incompatibility issue created by Apple. You will need to back down the Apple OS to High Sierra 10.13.6 or earlier.
The only Apple testing with our monitor is done by a non-Dell 3rd party lab hired by the monitor manufacturer. This Apple testing is very basic and does not include peripherals such as docks and dongles. They have 205 different Dell Laptop models to test on. They did not see the charging issue nor the wake issue on any of these 205 Dell Laptop tested on the U3818DW. I will not list all 205 models, but will list a sample here =
Alienware 13 R2 USB Type-C
Alienware 13 R3 USB Type-C
Alienware 15 R2 USB Type-C
Alienware 15 R3 USB Type-C
Alienware 15 R4 USB Type-C
Alienware 17 R3 USB Type-C
Alienware 17 R4 USB Type-C
Alienware 17 R5 USB Type-C
Chromebook 3380 USB Type-C
Chromebook 5190 2-in-1 USB Type-C
Inspiron 13-5370 USB Type-C
Inspiron 15-5570 USB Type-C
Inspiron 17-5770 USB Type-C
Latitude E5270 TB3
Latitude E5470 TB3
Latitude E5570 TB3
Latitude 3379 USB Type-C
Latitude 5280 USB Type-C
Latitude 5285 USB Type-C
Latitude 5289 USB Type-C
Latitude 5290 2-in-1 TB3/USB Type-C
Latitude 5495 USB Type-C
Latitude 5591 2-in-1 USB Type-C
Latitude 7275 USB Type-C
Latitude 7370 USB Type-C
Latitude 7380 USB Type-C
Latitude 7389 USB Type-C
Latitude 7480 TB3/USB Type-C
Precision 3510 USB Type-C
Precision 5510 TB3/USB Type-C
Precision 5520 TB3
Precision 7510 USB Type-C
Precision 7520 TB3
Precision 7530 TB3/USB Type-C
Precision 7710 USB Type-C
Precision 7720 TB3
Precision 7730 TB3/USB Type-C
XPS 12-9250 TB3/USB Type-C
XPS 13-9350 TB3/USB Type-C
XPS 13-9360 TB3/USB Type-C
XPS 13-9365 TB3/USB Type-C
XPS 13-9370 TB3/USB Type-C
XPS 15-9550 TB3/USB Type-C
XPS 15-9560 TB3/USB Type-C
XPS 27-7760 AIO TB3/USB Type-C
(edited)
nickpicker
6 Posts
1
February 25th, 2020 19:00
First you write, "Dell does not test or validate on Apple computers", then you go on and make detailed technical claims about Mac OS 10.14.3. So which one is it? And given that Apple never published detailed technical release notes for 10.14.3 to anyone, not even to registered developers, how come you or anyone at Dell could have obtained technical insights like the one you claim?
For what it's worth, your claim is untrue. There has not been a change in 10.14.3 that'd make it incompatible with the TPS65982. It's unclear whether you actually believe this to be true, or if it's just blame allocation. I must admit this is one of the most bizarre situations I've seen from technical support in a while.
Searching for "TPS65982 10.14.3" or "65982 10.14.3" turns up ZERO hits supporting your claim that Apple changed anything in 10.14.3 that'd make the U3818DW incompatible with Mac OS 10.14.3.
Apple has not obtained Thunderbolt 3 certification for a TPS65982-supporting driver in conjunction with certain Thunderbolt 3 connection scenarios, which do not apply here because the U3818DW is not a Thunderbolt display and does not require a Thunderbolt-aware connection to a computer.Ti's TPS65982 is compatible with any version of 10.14.x and 10.15.x otherwise you wouldn't even see a picture when connecting the display to a Mac. This is all completely unrelated to USB-C power delivery, and as the OP has proven, Dell's USB-C PD solution in the U3818DW is not spec-compliant.
To reiterate: the Dell U3818DW is not spec-compliant under any OS, including Windows.
Your untrue claim that this'd be something that's only broken in Mac OS 10.14.3 or later can be refuted quite easily, for instance by this Linux user who has observed the exact same issue with U3818DW's power delivery under Linux, unrelated to any version of Mac OS, as Linux and Mac OS do not share drivers for USB-C devices:
https://www.spinics.net/lists/linux-usb/msg189821.html
My sole USB-C device is a Dell Ultrasharp U3818DW monitor. When hooked up over its USB-C port, it supports USB-PD source, DisplayPort and USB hub functionality. It exposes two TI USB devices: 0451:8442 (hub) and 0451:82ff (a HID device?) along with the devices attached to its hub. Sometimes 82ff is replaced by 82ee.
Connecting the monitor to the laptop is problematic. *Reliably*, every 3±1 minutes, the monitor disconnects and reconnects a few seconds later, along with all devices attached to the monitor's USB hub, the monitor's DisplayPort, and power-delivery. It doesn't matter if the DisplayPort link is idle at the time. The kernel log shows no suspicious entries, apart from USB disconnect/new device chatter. Curiously, I occasionally see a new device announcement being logged before the disconnect message is.
Which is the exact same issue present in Mac OS, and the exact same issue the OP has proven to exist in Windows.
So again, it's unclear to me if you actually believe what you wrote, or if you've been fed bad information by someone else whose interest is in deflecting blame for Dell's faulty implementation of USB-C PD.
Searching the internet for sleep/wake issues in relation to "TPS65982" or "TI 65982" or "USB-C power delivery" turns up zero results EXCEPT in conjunction with the Dell U3818DW. In other words, the only sleep/wake issues ever observed under any OS with this chip occurred with this particular display only even though TI must have sold millions of the chip, deployed across many devices categories.
Also, you have claimed that there'd be no "charging issue nor the wake issue" on a large number of Dell laptops. Do you stand by this claim? For the record, do you claim that the Dell U3818DW will be able to charge the current-generation Dell XPS 13 over USB-C without causing any sleep/wake issues under Windows 10? We will have this laptop in our office today for extensive testing.
DELL-Chris M
Community Manager
Community Manager
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February 26th, 2020 05:00
First you write, "Dell does not test or validate on Apple computers", then you go on and make detailed technical claims about Mac OS 10.14.3. So which one is it?
* Both.
"Dell does not test or validate on Apple computers."
"The only Apple testing with our monitor is done by a non-Dell 3rd party lab hired by the monitor manufacturer. This Apple testing done by the non-Dell 3rd party lab is very basic and does not include peripherals such as docks and dongles."
And given that Apple never published detailed technical release notes for 10.14.3 to anyone, not even to registered developers, how come you or anyone at Dell could have obtained technical insights like the one you claim?
* The data about Apple OS Mojave 10.14.3 and the incompatibility was proven by the basic Apple testing done in the monitor manufacturer non-Dell 3rd party lab. The non-Dell 3rd party lab gave that information to our monitor manufacturer who in turn supplied it to us.
For what it's worth, your claim is untrue. There has not been a change in 10.14.3 that'd make it incompatible with the TPS65982.
* That is a speculative statement. The information supplied to us stated that the TPS6598E communication failed on Apple OS Mojave 10.14.3. Why don't you test their assertion by backing your Apple PC down to Apple OS High Sierra 10.13.6?
For what it's worth, your claim is untrue. There has not been a change in 10.14.3 that'd make it incompatible with the TPS65982.
* That is a speculative statement on your part unless an Apple OS engineer told you this.
Your untrue claim that this'd be something that's only broken in Mac OS 10.14.3 or later can be refuted quite easily, for instance by this Linux user who has observed the exact same issue with U3818DW's power delivery under Linux.
* Dell cannot speak to Linux OS. All can see here that Dell never offered Linux drivers. There is no way that Dell could know how the Linux OS is communicating with the U3818DW on a hardware and software level.
For the record, do you claim that the Dell U3818DW will be able to charge the current-generation Dell XPS 13 over USB-C without causing any sleep/wake issues under Windows 10?
* I can only relate to you the list of Dell XPS 13 PC tested by the monitor manufacturer non-Dell 3rd party lab. You will have to test the new XPS 13 (provide the exact model number when you get it) and let us know.
XPS 13-9350, TB3/USB Type-C, release date 10/22/2015
XPS 13-9360, TB3/USB Type-C, release date 10/19/2016
XPS 13-9365, TB3/USB Type-C, release date 12/23/2016
XPS 13-9370, TB3/USB Type-C, release date 1/15/2018
nickpicker
6 Posts
1
February 26th, 2020 06:00
You wrote,
XPS 13-9350, TB3/USB Type-C, release date 10/22/2015
XPS 13-9360, TB3/USB Type-C, release date 10/19/2016
XPS 13-9365, TB3/USB Type-C, release date 12/23/2016
XPS 13-9370, TB3/USB Type-C, release date 1/15/2018
We've acquired a brand new, current generation Dell XPS 13 with TB3/USB Type C, i7-10710U, 09R5Y, released in September 2019, and as expected it's not working correctly with the U3818DW's charging, either, just as the OP has proven. But I guess now you're going to claim, as you've repeatedly done, that this particular Dell laptop is not supported by the display because it's not on your list, even though Dell advertises USB-C charging for our laptop right on the product page and in the manual and many other places, and even though this laptop is even newer than the legacy ones you've listed. And I also guess you'll not have any intention to do anything about this incompatibility.
(edited)