Help with RAID failure please/ how do i swap out a HD?

Question

Started getting freq blue screen and almost impossible to boot without one. Tried re-installing XP over existing OS without improvement (and got the blue screen a few times during the installation). Chkdsk /R /P shows unrecoverable error after 75% and one of the 2 hard drives in my RAID array is listed as having an error when I boot. When the computer finally boots (takes multiple tries) it works fine except being prone to crash. Crucial data/documents are backed up. Can I merely swap out the troubled hard drive and be good to go with minimal or no data loss? I'm guessing it's more complicated than that. Can someone point me towards a tutorial or spoonfeed me the issues related to swapping out one of the 2 hard drives and instruct me how to do this? Of course the computer's just 3 mos out of warranty. Computer: XPS Dimmension 400/9150, Win XP Pro, Hard drives x 2: 160G, 7.2k Serial ATA, NTFS Much appreciated!

FDF321 · Answer

Thanks--always lessons learned.  I already backed up all document and data files onto a jump drive (and have a separate network hard drive for media), and since I can still get the computer to boot I will back up a few more things.   The instructions you reference give instructions to migrate the drives to Raid 1.  Any thoughts about how much data I'll lose and how successful this is likely to be?  Is there a way to figure out which data are on the faulty drive and can they be transferred to the good drive before the migration?  I've filled less than 1/2 the total space between the 2.   Or should I just replace the faulty drive and start over again with a complete OS and programs reinstallation (in which case I might as well replace both drives and start over with larger capacity and configure them as RAID 1)?   Thanks! ff

jackshack · Answer

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but you need to back up your data to external media ASAP. You are evidently running RAID 0 and there is no way you rebuild that array without losing data. Neither disk has a complete data copy so you will need to replace the failing drive and re-create the array.

To give you an idea of what you need to go through, see the Dimension 9200 User's Manual under the heading of Optimizing Performance/About Your RAID Configuration. This should be very similar to the computer you are actually using, but I've never found the info in those manuals.

Oops! My bad. Found it in the XPS 400 manual under Setting Up and Using Your Computer/About Your RAID Configuration. Looks pretty much the same, though.

Message Edited by JackShack on 01-19-2008 11:10 AM

Message Edited by JackShack on 01-19-2008 11:13 AM

jackshack · Answer

The computer has error checking that usually keeps your data intact when you copy from one storage device to another.  I figure any data you copy that doesn't give you an error message is likely ok.   Any programs or applications, however, will need to be reinstalled from the original media.  Installation makes changes to the registry that are required for Windows to allow the application to execute properly.  You cannot simply copy them from one drive to another.   Bottom line; copy the My Documents folder.  If you have a C:\Dell\Drivers directory you might also want to copy these as they are the original drivers for your system.  That way if you have trouble getting the drivers to work properly when you reinstall you can default to the ones that shipped with the computer.

FDF321 · Answer

Since I can still boot the computer, could I make a backup of everything on my HD(s) and then reinstall that on the new HD(s)? Or are there likely to be too many corrupt data and I should only save documents and individual files?  I'm trying to make this as easy for myself as possible and hate the idea of reinstalling every program on new HD.   Thank you!

shesagordie · Answer

FDF321

With RAID-0 when a hard drive fails, all the data is lost, because it's striped across both hard drives.

You need to use your third option and reinstall XP, drivers and applications.

To load the RAID driver, an internal floppy drive is needed.

Bev.

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jackshack · Answer

You can migrate a RAID 1 'cause you have two drives that mirror each other. If one dies, the other one gets used and you only get a message that the array has been degraded. In this RAID it is possible to replace the bad drive and use the data from the good one to build it back up to a complete set. RAID 0 doesn't have that redundancy. You are writing data alternately to each drive to speed up data transfer. Since neither drive is complete, the loss of one drive wipes out all your data; no way to recover.

Once you rebuild the array you will need to reinstall Windows. Many of the XPS series computers came with Windows installation disks that have the RAID drivers slipstreamed into them. If you have this all you should need to do is have the RAID bios rebuild the array and use the Windows CD to reinstall. Windows will look at the array as though it were one drive, so this part of the procedure goes just like you are installing on a single drive. The only hiccup you will have is if the Windows CD doesn't have the RAID drivers. You usually handle this by having the drivers on a 3.5" floppy and putting it into the floppy drive when you get the "press F6 to load third party drivers" message at the bottom of the Windows installation screen. Not difficult, but the program expects you to have an internal floppy drive. Certain USB floppies will handle it when you have the bios set to use one, but I can't remember exactly which ones so you will need to search.

Once you have installed Windows, you need to install the rest of the drivers; usually Desktop System Software and Chipset Driver in that order since some of the rest depend on the presence of these. Dell suggests the next drivers be those for the video adapter, network adapter, and sound adapter, followed by anything else, your choice. Bear in mind not all Dells have Desktop System Software, generally found in System Utilities on the downloads page, but yours probably does. If not, begin with the Chipset Driver.

Good luck!

Sigh. Typing too long again.

Message Edited by JackShack on 01-19-2008 03:17 PM

FDF321 · Answer

Do you think I'll buy myself too much trouble if I make a whole backup image of my HDs with Acronis or Ghost onto an external HD, install 2 new internal HDs, and then restore in entirety to the new drives?

jackshack · Answer

I'm afraid that's new territory for me.  I would imagine, though, you could probably do it provided the imaging program you use has drivers for your array.  Be aware that it is problematic with a failing hard drive; errors will slow down the copy and could extend the time required to the point of total drive failure.  If you want to experiment I recommend you make the straight back-up of your My Documents folder first, then play as you like.

FDF321 · Answer

Thanks everyone for their help. Here's what I did: 1) I backed up my whole hard drive as an image on an external HD using Acronis True Image (free trial download, completely functional, only downside is that it requires a reboot to install), and I created an Acronis recovery/boot CD and tested it. Before doing that I had previously made fresh backups on a jump drive of all of my documents and crucial files, emails, outlook backup, etc. (my media already were on a separate external NDAS drive). 2) I removed both 150G hard drives, replacing them with 300G Seagate HDs (but could have just replaced the one faulty one). 3) I followed the setting up RAID instructions out of the manual that JackShack sent me, and configured one of the new drives for RAID 1. 4) I rebooted with the Acronis CD and initiated full disk recovery from my external hard drive. 4a) I did receive one error message right at the beginning of the recovery: 'Partition error. MFT bitmap corrupted, check these partitions with your operating system disk tools.' The rest of the recovery went uneventfully, taking maybe 30 min (no compression). 5) Voila! The computer rebooted and appears exactly like my old set up. 6) To be on the safe side I'm also reinstalling Windows XP over the old one because I did that already with the faulty drive and got a couple BSD's during the install. So I'll have to install the Win updates, but that sure beats having to reinstall all of my prior applications. ff

jackshack · Answer

Congratulations!  You've done a great job and learned a lot in the process.   Happy Computing!

FDF321 · Answer

Unfortunately, I spoke too soon. I continued to get the blue screen of death. Next I tried booting with F11 and restoring to the computer's original state (from my mirrored backup), and still got a BSD when booting after that restore. Next, I ran the Dell diagnostic program for blue screen and came up right where I started, error code 0F00:0244, at least 2 different blocks of memory with uncorrectable data before I gave up.

So I unraided and re-raided my hard drives and am in the process of reinstalling everything from scratch. XP just finished loading and booting without a BSD. Of course this makes me wonder whether the whole problem was software, not hardware...

jackshack · Answer

I would suspect that some of the errors on your array were pulled into your image.  The imaging programs have error detection too, but I don't think it is as extensive as the copy utilities most of us are accustomed to.   Sorry it didn't quite work out, but at least you know it's possible to image an array.

FDF321 · Answer

Somehow my hard drive is now labelled by the computer as drive 'L:' rather than 'C:' under Hard Disk Drives, while one of the Devices with Removable Storage got named 'C:'. Any idea how to fix? If I rename it 'Local Disk (C:)' it becomes 'Local Disk (C:)(L:)

jackshack · Answer

My initial reaction to this is that you can't. Unlike previous versions of Windows, Windows XP keeps track of each disk and the drive letter assigned to it. The drive letter follows the drive to whatever port it is connected to in a SATA system. If Windows gets installed on drive L due to another drive being present that it thinks is C, you get a ton of references in the registry that expects various pieces of the system to be on the drive called "L". Microsoft does provide a way to switch the drive letter in the case of a cloned drive, but as you have done a reinstallation I don't think it applies.

So long as you remember what your boot drive is when you are installing programs or saving files your computer will work just fine regardless of the letter assigned to the boot drive. If the aesthetics are too disturbing the only for sure way to cure it is to delete the partition and start over, this time making sure that your RAID is the only hard drive attached to the system the first time it gets booted.

If you wish to experiment, recognizing that you may be forced to do a reinstallation if it goes wrong, the Microsoft guidance is here. To see some guidance from another forum you can check this.

Message Edited by JackShack on 01-21-2008 09:45 PM

FDF321 · Answer

It was weird, the 'drives' that took priority in the lettering were listed as 'Removable drive c thru F', then my CD & DVD drives, and THEN the hard drive. Everything was empty except the one CD drive that had the XP on it. I didn't even have any jump drives plugged in (and when I've used them after installation they get listed as removable drives starting with letters after the hard drive

Storage, Drives & Media

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